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**JaredExtreme** · 08-31-2002, 08:05 PM

LoL. Once the guillotine in the guard is sunk in, there is very little you can do besides muscle out of it.

Basically, you have to focus on avoiding it.

The reason the guard guillotine is catching you by surprise is probably doe to your opponent suddenly pulling you in with his legs. You have to expect this. If your opponent consistently pulls you in, let him. Once your forward up on his body slap on the "can opener" neck crank.

For the standing guillotine you have a little more hope. I found a good demo at http://www.jiu-jitsu.net/techniques/submission/ .
This is a good counter, there is another option if you don't want to pick up your oppoenent. After you put your arm over the shoulder, POST your lower arm against the knee instead of going behind and cupping it. Your position should be relatively safe now, and you can wrap your leg around your opponents and do a trip. Make sure when you trip that you move to the side of your opponent and go into side countrol. If you go straight forward after the trip you will land in his guard (no good).

**MrPoopy** · 08-31-2002, 11:35 PM

There are counters for the guilletene from the guard. The best counter that i've seen so far is when you are both on your knees or if you are both standing. He applies a guilletene and you feel that he is trying to put you in the guard to complete it. Before he can go back and put you into the guard, you put him in the guard. This defense still requires you to put an arm over the opposite shoulder of the one your head is stuck under. Reach as far onto his back as possible. If he continues to hold the guilletene on you, it's easy to see a possible shoulder crank. Just grab his wrist with your other hand, and use your body to shift his arm up just enough so that you can grab it with the hand drapped over his back.

There is another one where the guy already has the choke on you and you can resist it for a very long time, but i can't remember all the details. I used it a while back on a judo guy and ended up getting a mount on him because the guilletene failed.

Also, try putting your tongue to the roof of your mouth and gritting your teeth and tightening your neck as hard as possible. You will be able to resist a little longer this way, but you still have to work your way out of it. If not you will end up tapping.

Try the first technique. Just put him in the guard if he goes for it standing or on his knees. very easy shoulder crank.

**doubleouch** · 09-02-2002, 10:58 PM

You just need to practice better posture. If he is getting you in guillotine you are fighting with your head down. Keep your head up and hunch your shoulders up if he sits up on you. If you do these 2 simple things no more guillotine! When you are in someones guard you should be sitting up straight if possible with your hands on their belt or pants waist with your elbows in and head up.

**MrPoopy** · 09-02-2002, 11:16 PM

doubleouch is right. you must practice correct posture when inside the guard. sitting up with good posture will force your opponent to resort to other techniques.

**JaredExtreme** · 09-03-2002, 03:17 AM

Very good advice.

**Bau13** · 09-03-2002, 05:36 AM

swweeet....

I got another class in a couple of days... will remember what y'all said...

hopefully I wont get caught again!! well not as often anyways!

thanks alot guys...

**GrdStorm** · 09-04-2002, 10:53 AM

Another thought.

When rolling with my buddies I notice I can get them into a guard guillotine rather easy. They don't know much about grappling so when I grappling with them they tend to concentrate on hold downs and tying up my hands. All I have to do is distract them some how. Usually I move my legs up a little higher so they think I'm going to pull a triangle or something. Once they let go of my wrist, I can just pull their head down into a guillotine. My advice to you is to always watch your neck!! If thats your weakspot then be conscience about it.

One of my friends had a thing for leg locks and he somehow always slapped it on me. So after a while I got smart about it and I began to guard against it. After that, no more leg locks

**kid lock** · 09-04-2002, 12:01 PM

When your sparring with the (boxing) gloves on remember to then keep your chin tucked, not up.

**GRACIEAUSTIN** · 09-04-2002, 01:46 PM

reach your arm over their shoulder, not the side your head is on & use the hand that is on the choking side to pull down on their choking arm. This will buy you time. Try to pass guard on the opposite side of your head. This works best for me. Or I roll & try to work my way out of it. - www.austinjj.com

**Bau13** · 09-17-2002, 11:49 AM

hey guys...well trained again and.... DIDNT GET CAUGHT AT ALL with the guillotine!!!!

This time around had better posture and guarded my neck alot more...
One guy did try to pull one on me but I pulled gurad before he did..
I tried goin for that shoulder crank..but he felt it was comin so he let go of my head!

So...I dont think I should fall into that so easily anymore guys
Thanks alot for the techniques!!!

**Mr. Miyagi** · 09-17-2002, 03:20 PM

The defense of reaching over the opposite shoulder with one arm and holding on to the choking arm with the other hand is a way of defending the standing guillotine, and it only buys you time, it's not an escape. You can't use that technique if you're in someone's guard and they're using the guillotine on you.

If you find yourself in a guillotine from the guard, use the arm opposite the side your head is trapped to cradle your opponent's head, then rise from your knees to your feet, and press your shoulder into your opponent's neck and force him to release the guillotine. You can continue from here and pass the guard in this situation. Have your teacher show you.

Another way out of the standing guillotine is to pick your opponent up and take them down into side control so that your head is trapped cross body on them, then you cradle their head with the opposite arm as I mentioned before and apply pressure on their neck with your shoulder. Never try to mount your opponent before escaping the guillotine and never take them down so your body is on the same side of them that your head is trapped on.

**MrPoopy** · 09-17-2002, 04:59 PM

Mr. Miyagi, instead of reaching over his shoulder on the opposite side, you can post your hand, come up on your feet and allow your head to go down to the mat. It doesn't just buy you a little time, it allows you to resist the guilletene until you are broken back down. When you're up on your feet like that, he won't have enough leverage to tighten the choke.

The details on that might not be right... but we went over it one night in class and it made the choke very easy to resist.

**crazyjoe380** · 09-17-2002, 07:00 PM

i found that peeing on yourself helps your apponent unlock the choke..

SCHNIZTZLEHOPPER TOUGHT ME THAT ONE..LOL..

**Mr. Miyagi** · 09-17-2002, 11:55 PM

Mr. Poopy, that getting on the feet part is a good concept, but is part of the technique I mentioned. You press your shoulder into his neck to force him to release.
You didn't quite make yourself clear...

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escape from guillotine in guard....

escape from guillotine in guard....

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