My initial BJJ experience

[MrPoopy]

Will it cost you anything to enter?

I have never competed before but I imagine you'll run into some good grapplers if you go. I'm doing Judo now and I'm hoping to go to some Judo tournaments after I train for a while.

Losing 6 pounds should not be a problem. Just eat a lot of fruit and vegetables and don't drink any pop.

[raytor]

20 bucks and yeah thats all I'm eating now and come friday I'll dehydrate out anything left over.Thanks for all the input ..its appreciated

[MrPoopy]

I wouldn't dehydrate myself too much. It'll catch up to you come tournament time.

[Szczepankiewicz]

Any clown can teach you something which they 'know' and which you do not. However, if you are paying money to learn something, I'd only pay from a reputable source. There is a huge difference between the technical ability of a blue belt and a brown belt in BJJ.


Granted, anyone can invent their own style and fabricate their own credentials, but you won't catch me paying a TKD green belt to teach me grappling.

Learning things the wrong way is far more difficult to fix than not knowing them at all.


Spanky

[doubleouch]

To clarify how a brown belt can be a legit instructor I can tell you that a brown belt in bjj is the equivalent of a 5th degree black belt in most arts, especially tkd etc. I know because I have a 3rd degree belt in tkd and am much more proud of my bjj blue belt. One of the issues may be that beginners and advanced students are all in the same class. This makes it hard to give beginners all the attention that they need. I would say stick with it. The most important thing is the actual sparring mat time. It sounds like you are getting plenty of that. Learn what he teaches and try to apply it. If he is any good at all you will learn all the basics in time.

[Szczepankiewicz]

Doubleouch, do you have any evidence to support that?


What I am going off of is proficiency in a particular art. If you are a brown belt, then odds are you know the art pretty well, if you are a black belt you are supposed to have mastered all the basic techniques and understand each of them completely.

Personally I would be happy to roll with anyone from any art who can teach me stuff. I am a perpetual student.

However, if I'm going to pay money to someone to teach me I want to be certain that they know what they are talking about. Simply knowing more than me doesn't make you a professional instructor.

Keep in mind that when you compare a brown belt in BJJ and a 5th degree black belt in any other art, we are not comparing style vs style in 'no holds barred' 'combat'.

What I am talking about is how well you know the art that you are teaching.

Take for example my instructor, he's a 4th degree blackbelt in jujutsu. He knows what he is teaching me inside and out, upside down and I have learned a tremendous amount from him ON THIS ART. He doesn't have a fancy list of credentials, and he doesn't have a window full of trophies. He does have experience in bjj, judo, and other arts, but he is not charging me money to teach me that.

So getting back to my original question, what qualifies a blue belt to be an independent BJJ instructor? Is there an official process that 'certifies' the instructors? Are they endorsed by their instructor?

[Kirves]

I have often seen that an "undergrad" can be a legit teacher when it is under a supervision of a legit teacher. Many organizations use this way to spread to areas they have no schools. They let a blue belt or what ever do the basic teaching, but then few times a year the actual legit instructor comes in for a seminar or camp to check out how they are doing - sort of quality check. And of course, the blue belt won't be handing out any rank, that's done by the legit instructor in the seminars. And the blue belt is required to train periodically (like attend one class a week or something) at the instructor's facility to make sure his quality is not compromised either.

[Szczepankiewicz]

Is there a difference in the price you pay to the 'legit' instructor who is a blue belt than that of a purple, brown, or black belt?

[MrPoopy]

A brown belt in BJJ means many years of experience. I would trust a brown belt to teach me stuff if I knew he was a legit bjj brown belt.

[Szczepankiewicz]

It's not really a matter of trust to which I am speaking. I would trust a blue belt. Hell Poopy, I'd even train with YOU. But I'm not paying for it unless there's some kind of structure to guarantee me that you REALLY know what you're doing.

I am the tenth grand master of Ju Funk Su, and I have crosstrained in BJJ. Therefore pay me $50 a month and I'll instruct you.

[MrPoopy]

So you'd want to see some kind of certification? I don't think certificates are given out with belts in BJJ but I could be wrong. I guess it would be a good idea to find out who the instructor in question got his rank from and give em a call to verify it.

When I first started BJJ I had no idea what kind of martial art is was. I can remember talking to the instructor on the phone just before I went over to watch a class to see what it was all about. He asked me what martial art I was looking for and I told him Judo. He said they were doing Jiu-Jitsu. I replied "What kind of KARATE is that?"

Credability was the last thing on my mind. I did think it was pretty odd that he only had a purple belt, but then I learned more about BJJ and it made sense. If I train with any grappler now, I would want to roll with them atleast a few times before I decided to pay them for instruction.

One of the reasons I like my Judo club is I don't pay anything for it. And all of the regular guys have tons of experience.

[Szczepankiewicz]

I don't necessarily need a 'certificate' to prove anything to me. However, I am asking what kind of validation system BJJ uses to provide customers with a reasonable expectation for the money they spend.

If you aren't paying anything, then you're probably getting your money's worth. I also recently started going back to Judo and I don't have to pay.

Even after all this discussion, I still want my question answered.

What makes a blue belt in BJJ qualified to instruct?

[Kirves]

Originally posted by Szczepankiewicz
But I'm not paying for it unless there's some kind of structure to guarantee me that you REALLY know what you're doing.

Often, if there is a legit instructor supervicing in the background, you'll know about it, if not sooner, then at last when it's time to award ranks. Would you pay to the blue belt, if Rickson Gracie was there to assure you that he personally puts his stamp of approval on your certificate and will guarantee everything you learn is up to his standards, even he is not usually around?

This is often the case (of course not Rickson every time... ) with these blue belt instructors. There just aren't enough BJJ black belts to go around yet.

[Szczepankiewicz]

Let's see if I can get this.

The key element that lends legitimacy to a Blue Belt BJJ instructor is official affiliation with a recognized Black Belt in BJJ?


Is that correct?

[Kirves]

Well, this is not a BJJ thing. It's not done in all BJJ organizations, though I've seen some of them do this. It is also frequently done by other art organizations too.

Often it is done under names like "affiliated training group" and similar. If the only way for an art to spread around was for someone with a black belt to move to another area, arts would remain quite unknown.

Many organizations let less than fully qualified people to lead a training group in an area where fully legit instructors are not available. This is usually conditional, the leader of the group is not allowed to make claims to have full teaching rights or to hand out ranks. He is usually required to train at the "headquarters" frequently and report on what is happening. Then a legit person from the HQ acts as a supervisor and makes sure the quality is kept at necessary level.

This is done by many organizations of different arts and is no big deal really. This is actually the most common way I've seen an art being spread. Often the individual who leads the distance training group has already rank in other arts, like a traditional jujutsu black belt has no trouble leading a BJJ group even if he himself has only blue belt in BJJ. A Shotokan black belt has no trouble leading a Wado-ryu karate training group even if he himself has been ranked only green belt in it. And so on.

The best bet here is to go ask the blue belt himself about this. If he avoids the issue, then go elsewhere. If he tells you his affiliation and who let him teach a group, then you may choose yourself if this is acceptable by your standards.