Gracie's in pride

[Sean Dempsey]

Why can't these "great" fighters who are in the "guard for 3 hours", you know... pass the guard?

[JaredExtreme]

Miyagi is correct. I used to be a "Gracie" fan, but now I am a "BJJ" fan. Simply put: I don't believe the current roster of Gracies is representing their family well. Rickson is moping around, Royce IMO is done in MMA, and Royler/Renzo/Ryan are merely good.... not SPECTACULER.

This next PRIDE will be a huge determining factor as to whether or not the current generation of Gracies can hold on in the MMA arena. If they are all soundly defeated... god help us all.

[Mr. Miyagi]

Most fighters fighting against a bjj'er would rather pound away from inside the guard. Passing guard is an unnecessary risk.

There are other fighters that use the guard more aggressively, like Frank Shamrock, or Newton, or Sak in the QJ fight. The Gracies in mma usually just lie there and try not to get hit. They don't try to sweep or sub.

When I didn't know what a triangle choke was it was fun to see Severn get caught in it. He didn't know what it was either and even so it still took Royce some 17 minutes to sink it. That was boring.

Renzo and Newton should be a good fight.

[JaredExtreme]

That triangle tap has to be one of the greatest early moments in MMA.

[jules]

The gracies won't be able to be what they were because they don't train with each other like they used to. Rickson was great because he had his father, Rolls, and his uncles/cousins to mold him. Now even if a Gracie has the talent of Carlos, Helio, Rolls, or Rickson he won't be as good as his relatives because he won't be able to train with the legends with his family from say 11 on.

[Cain]

i have a huge amount of respect for the gracies.. and most of all for Rickson.. but this nuthugging have to stop.. when they don't fight.. they don't deserve to be lifted up to the sky as gods.. when somone hasn't fought for many years... and show no plans of returning? why should we consider him the greatest fighter _now_ ? he _was_ one of the greatest warriors... champions.. but these concepts isn't something you are.. and for ever will be.. they are something you can become..

Rickson has all the reasons in the world for not fighting.. Rockson.. his age.. his superb record.. ito seems he have too much to loose..

so again, i have a lot of respect. BUT.. until rickson fights one of todays top fighters.. stop mentioning his name like he just won the middle weight division in both pride and ufc..

[Strider]

what ever happened to Ralph Gracie? That guy was a pure sav back in the days when i watched him.

[Strider]

what ever happened to Ralph Gracie? That guy was a pure sav back in the days when i watched him.

[Toudiyama[NL]]

What amazes me most is the fact that anyone bearing the Gracie name somehow is considered a good fighter

[MMA fanatic]

i think rickson shud fight sakuraba in the UFC

[Mr. Heel Hook]

Originally posted by Toudiyama[NL]
What amazes me most is the fact that anyone bearing the Gracie name somehow is considered a good fighter

Most likely because they are...

[Sean Dempsey]

People often confuse the name with the people. The Gracie name is an institution, a developed form of Jiu Jitsu and a very specific way of teaching said art. "Gracie" is like saying "Ferrari". Not every Ferrari runs at 100%, in fact I bet there are plenty of broken down, old, rusted Ferrari's in garages all over the world.

But you can't deny the Ferarri name in the world of high performance autos, just like you can't deny the Gracie name in Jiu Jitsu and MMA.

"Gracie" isn't a person, it's a jiu jitsu methodology and philosphy. And no matter if you're a Tito, Sylvio, Shamrock, Curr or whoever else fan, the Gracie name remains as stedfast and important today as ever.

[Mr. Miyagi]

I agree with most of what Sean said. But a couple things I think:

The so called Gracie method does not really exist as they would like people to believe. The way any individual instructor teaches is somewhat unique. The Jacare teaches is different from the way JJ Machado teaches, both are excellent guys to learn from. Pedro Sauer and Rorion are different from each other, though both are part of this "Gracie method". I even think Rorion and Royce are pretty different, but Royce and Royler are similar. GJJ and BJJ are the same thing, and there isn't really any difference in the way things are taught. Rorion wants to publicize that there is a difference, to ultimately make more money for his family; nothing wrong with that.

Ralph was pretty aggressive back then. He's a bit older now. That kickboxer who's name I forget, Ralph easily beat him once but the second time he went through hell before winning. I think he can be competitive against the LW fighters out there but not really a contender. He's one of the best bjj teachers though. I think he has the highest standards as far as belt promotion in the country. I wish the fight between Ralph and Mikey Burnett had actually come to fruition a few years back, that would have been really interesting.

Royce has never really been a coach or trainer for fights of this magnitude. I wonder what he'll do to prepare his boys for this one. He better give them hell in the coming weeks.

[bhothak]

everything you guys talk about is only the gracies....i'm a big fan of the gracies to, but i never have a thought that they were the best fighter of all time....i just like the way they fight and the style they create...!!
about rickson...did you see any of his 400 fight straight wins without a loss??
how about rorion...how good is he? he maybe old...but when he were young...?
remember though...the gracies already a champion even before we knew what grappling is...or how to neutralize your oponents in the most effective ways.....

well thats what i think of the graices...

[Mr. Heel Hook]

There is no difference between GJJ and BJJ, eh? Don't know about that one...