Krabi Krabong Hand to Hand

[jg7]

Hi Guys,

Any one heard of a krabi krabong teacher in thailand that also teaches hand to hand combat?

John Guest

[chalambok]

I never heard of one who didn't.

[jg7]

Hi,

Have you heard of a teacher called Ajarn Thonglor, if yes is thus guy any good?

thanks

john

[george stando]

ajarn thonglor is a classical teacher and you need to be introduced, and spent time with him and evolve along those lines to get to that. You can doublecheck that with the italians and his students but I met him a couple of times and you have to be sure there are active classes to participate in as well. Dont know much more than that. You have to doublecheck that info.

[sportmuaythai]

I assume that you're speaking of Ajarn Thonglor of SriTrirat. He is a very respected person. His school is very welknown for sword and knife training. I don't think that he trains any more, yet he still over see the training. I met him about four years ago, and he was very old, a very kind and generous person. I don't know how his health is now. I don't know if he accepts foreigners any more, because I heard that he has had a very bad experience with one. If you can get accepted into his school, consider yourself very lucky. His school is kind of difficult to find. I went to see him by myself, and was not introduced by any body. He agreed to accept me, but his school received an important engagement and I never got to train there. Still I respect kru Thonglor very much.
Learning traditional fighting arts can be very tiring and need much dedication. BTW kru Thonglor also teaches modern swordmanship like foil epe' and sabre. He has trained many champions.

[george stando]

Thonglor was with his top guys and military and he said directly in thai if the student is not introduced then he will accept him but will only a certain amount of basics until he knows him. Follows the old path especially for foreigners and i assumed he meant foreigners. You can certainly give it a shot if thats what you want but like sportsmuaythai said its a long path and be ready to dig in either way. it was all in thai for the top guys so it was inside stuff. the only foreigner that soiled his name is the italian with the fancy website who is an embarassment to the thai martial arts/

[jg7]

George/Sports muay thai,

once again respect to both of you being so honest with your thoughts.

One question if you can answer Ajarn thonglor is he versed in muay thai?

if yes have you seen it?

and is it deep and effective when compared to muay chaiya?

thanks

john

[george stando]

Dont want to overstep my bounds here as many claim but muay thai is muay thai, you aint getting it any better than a muay thai camp, end of story. You go to a hardcore muay thai camp with the thais only and be ready for an experience. I wouldnt go anywhere else for muay thai but a top notch muay thai camp.
I saw the empty hand stuff and it was good but I didnt practice it. One must practice to ((see)) really but again why go to thailand for that aspect? If you want aliveness and real stuff to use then why pay all that money, travel, time and effort unless you want an exotic vacation. If you want the full experience of going to thailand, playing the whole game with the instructor, spending forever getting to the top of the road that is available to you elsewhere then its ok but accept that fact and roll with it. I am just trying to be truthful becuase I was helped by a foreigner who saw through all this and helped me see too. I had a hard time but now I see it clearly.
There is no more gap between asians and westerners, we have closed it down effectively in the fields of mma and self defense in my own humble opinion. They could actually learn from us. If you look at the muay chaiya footage, we(meaning those westerners well schooled in these areas ) can easily show them how to fight in real time for real, they cant seem to figure it out at all or are too egotistical to try or are clueless how to train something is missing to produce such a poor result.
Im going to train it because I love the cultural aspects and the history though i am just learning aboutit now. But I dont think for a minute any of those guys are going to school me on whats real, whats going to work on a street corner in the us, england or france for that manner or how to train scientifically and effectively...i have seen none of that in thailand by anyone at anytime and i will be living and training there full time shortly and will report back on that. My goal is muay thai primarily to compete then learn the rest slowly over time.
Stay away from the over hyped websites, those proclaiming to be the only ones, the first this and that,I am the grandmasters only student, I am the grandmaster!,only I can teach you, my school is the only one authorized, its the new selling environment there and here. Everything is polluted with the nonsense. Hopefully you can find a teacher that is true and teaches from his heart and wants to teach you and loves to teach you, its what makes the martial arts what they are, a positive experience not a forgetful negative one.
Alot of people dont agree with me but thats ok i accept that but I ran the course so i know at least a little something and I know people who have run the course for along, long time.
I would get sportsmuaythai opinion to balance it out then go from there. At least i hope this helps somewhat.....

[sportmuaythai]

Dont want to overstep my bounds here as many claim but muay thai is muay thai, you aint getting it any better than a muay thai camp, end of story. You go to a hardcore muay thai camp with the thais only and be ready for an experience. I wouldnt go anywhere else for muay thai but a top notch muay thai camp.
If you look at the muay chaiya footage, we(meaning those westerners well schooled in these areas ) can easily show them how to fight in real time for real, they cant seem to figure it out at all or are too egotistical to try or are clueless how to train something is missing to produce such a poor result.
Im going to train it because I love the cultural aspects and the history though i am just learning aboutit now.

Training with kru Thonglor would be similar to training muay chaiya with a very good teacher. You train because you love the art. I may be wrong, but I think that Sritrirat is one of two schools that originated from the security service provided to the royal court in the early days when Bangkok became capital. They are sword institute, and their knife tactics are one of the best in the country. But I definitely would go elsewhere for efficient muaythai training. I also would not go to kru Lek or kru Praeng for muay chaiya. But then, I'm still stiff and sore from muaythai training that I've given my bike training (my second love) a miss this morning. Does this have anything to do with muay chaiya? lol.

[Tee Sok]

George and sportmuaythai, very interesting posts. Thanks for sharing.

I agree with what you guys said about ring muay thai and ancient muay thai.

Ring muay thai is focused on fighting, its training is focused on fighting and this is what. Fighters are used to hitting and getting hit, and to dealing with
adrenaline. All real fight situations.
Ancient muay thai has more techniques, and I could see some techs are meant to strike or defend on a battlefield, when people are surrounded by
soldiers swarming all around. Just like in Krabi Krabong.

Not a ring confrontation, very hardly a street confrontation.

I would cross-train ring muay thai and ancient muay thai for better results
as George and Sportmuaythai said, and it does make sense.

There were and there are teachers that can make ancient muay work, but
things evolve and you have to evolve with them.
So I can answer your question, Sportsmuaythai: no, it doens't have anything to do with most Muay Chayia and it shouldn't be like this!

BTW bike was my first love, MA came later, I think riding a bike is great for
endurance and for your breath.

[jg7]

Hi Teesok,

how is your muay chaiya teacher? is muay chaiya very practical against multiple attackers as on the street most fighting is betwwen 2/3 or more against one person and muay chaiya i think works one on one, while i think krabi krabong hand to hand works against many attackers

thanks

john

[Tee Sok]

My teacher learned muay Chaiya with kru Tong and he teaches thai sword and staff as well.

As I said on another post I am a beginner in Chaiya so I cannot speak from
my experience.
I saw him train advanced students with bags and pads and that looked pretty much like modern muay thai. So yes I would say Chaiya works but the thing is you must know how to make it work and I haven't reached that level.

Multiple attackers on the street............I am lucky I never dealt with this situation and this is a matter of strategy like letting attackers stumble on each other and find the quickest way to run away.
JKD is specialised in street situations and you can definitely learn
faster doing that.

I learned thai sword and a bit of staff but not empty hand KK.

[jg7]

Teesok,

i have sent you an email to your email address

thanks

john

[george stando]

multiple opponent stuff is better addressed directly by kk and less so by muay because muay was more sport against a single opponent and some self defense.