kickboxing vs. muay thai differences?

[huey]

except for elbows and knees are there any other differences between the two?
do they teach these weapons in both arts?
are the punches different in terms of body position on impact?
thanks.

[S.Anucha]

Kickboxing was created by Karate practitioners 30 odd years ago, there are some elements of Muay Thai which have been added to the style, such as knee strikes and elbow strikes but thats about as far as it would go. Kickboxing is only similar to Muay Thai because both use rings in competitions, both have refs, both use weighted gloves, and both have weight divisions.... rounds in Muay Thai are usually always 5 x 3 minutes whereas in Kickboxing they can be like in western boxing, anything from 3 to 12. Kickboxing also has the "razmataz" feel to it, a bit like Don King promotions, something that I do not like, They use Karate techniques and styles that are nothing like Muay Thai.... Kickboxing and Muay Thai are 2 completely different art forms. The way you stand in Kickboxing, punch, kick basicly everything in Kickboxing is not the way its done in Muay Thai, you bob and weave in kickboxing, do that in Thai boxing and you'll get a knee up the face!

Kickboxing is a 30 year old art form taken from karate

Muay Thai is a heritage of Thailand used to protect themselves against invading armies.

[MuayThaiFighter]

Kickboxing is a martial arts that was invented when some Americans went to Thailand and studied MuayThai and brought it back to U.S but changed a few things to suite them and called it kickboxing and then took credit for the skills.

Kickboxing was originally MuayThai turned into boxing with karate kicks.

In kickboxing like in karate the round house kicks are done with the top part of the foot where as in MuayThai their round house kicks are done using the shins.

Actually S.Anucha is wrong because in Muay Thai we do learn bobs and weaving.

As far as the punching is concerned it is pretty much the same in both MuayThai and Kickboxing however we use elbows and knees as well as you stated but kickboxing doesn't.

Another thing is MuayThai has the clinching and Kickboxing doesn't as far as I know.

[grubbogoppoly]

So if kickboxing doesn't use the same kicks and doesn't use the elbows and kicks. then how is it watered down muay thai brought by people who studied muay thai and brought it to america? Just curious as to your line of thinking.

[MuayThaiFighter]

Originally posted by grubbogoppoly
So if kickboxing doesn't use the same kicks and doesn't use the elbows and kicks. then how is it watered down muay thai brought by people who studied muay thai and brought it to america? Just curious as to your line of thinking.

Sorry I just looked it up again and I am mistaken.

Kickboxing originally came from Karate (Japan) and Tae Kwon Do (Korea) however after having fought against MuayThai fighters and realizing that they were the domanent fighters kickboxers started to change their karate and tae kwon techniques especially the kicks to those of MuayThai.

Todays U.S. kickboxers throw almost exclusively Thai kicks, wear Thai shorts, yet incorrectly say that kickboxing is the combination of boxing and karate.

Kickboxing as practiced today mainly has techniques from only
two arts: (1) Western Boxing for hands, and (2) Muay Thai for kicks (and knees, elbows, and clinching where the rules permit).

So now the terms "Kickboxing" and "Muay Thai" apply not only to "TECHNIQUES" but also to "RULES"! Kickboxing long replaced the techniques of karate and tae kwon do. In terms of rules, kickboxing rules do not allow anything beyond kicking and punching (keep in mind that in terms of techniques the kicks of today's kickboxers are primarily from Muay Thai regardless of rules). In contrast, the rules of Muay Thai allows all Muay Thai techniques to be used including knees, elbows and clinching.

The United States and Japan however, adopted Muay Thai techniques but kept the generic name "kickboxing".

So basically Kickboxing of today and MuayThai are the same other then the rules. I think by U.S and Japan keeping the name kickboxing after changing the style to MuayThai it means they are basically taking credit for what they now use.

Actually S.Anucha is wrong because in Muay Thai we do learn bobs and weaving.

[Thai Bri]

I was under the impression that Kickboxing in the USA started when ordinary Karate-ka put gloves on, and went at it full contact. Then it developed, i.e. boxing blows for the hands, and more fluid kicks etc.

[S.Anucha]

Originally posted by MuayThaiFighter
Kickboxing is a martial arts that was invented when some Americans went to Thailand and studied MuayThai and brought it back to U.S but changed a few things to suite them and called it kickboxing and then took credit for the skills.

Kickboxing was originally MuayThai turned into boxing with karate kicks.

In kickboxing like in karate the round house kicks are done with the top part of the foot where as in MuayThai their round house kicks are done using the shins.

Actually S.Anucha is wrong because in Muay Thai we do learn bobs and weaving.

As far as the punching is concerned it is pretty much the same in both MuayThai and Kickboxing however we use elbows and knees as well as you stated but kickboxing doesn't.

Another thing is MuayThai has the clinching and Kickboxing doesn't as far as I know.

Actually I am not wrong! Bobs and weaves are not taught in Muay Thai they have been taken from Western boxing and added to the skills of the more skillful Muay Thai boxers, slips are taught in Muay Thai, you do a full bob mate in Muay Thai and your asking for a knee.... belive me it is not taught in Muay Thai! I have been trained in Muay Chao Chur/Muay Boran and never once was I trained to bob and weave and when I did do it I was asked to stop! You can do it but its a risk you are taking.... I dont mean to correct you but simply state that it is not a traditional Muay Thai method of evasion. Many Muay Thai boxers in Thailand watch western boxing and take from it skills and add to their own as they feel western boxing has a lot to give in terms of "boxing" skills.

Unless you are talking aboiut slips, what are you talking about, a full bob and weave? I dunno I am confused now.


Quote:

Kickboxing :-

"...Kickboxing started in the US during the 1970's when American karate practitioners became frustrated with strict controls on martial arts competitions that didn't allow full contact kicks and punches. Many questions were raised when the sport began about the high risk of injury. As a result, safety rules were improved and protective clothing was added. As this is a relatively new sport there are no long-term traditions. The sport has undergone changes and been refined during the last two decades. Competitors use sparring, kicks, punches, kick blocks, shadow boxing, and wood breaking that is learned and applied under professional instruction..."

Muay Thai :-

"...Most of what is known about the early history of Thai Boxers comes from Burmese accounts of warfare between Myanmar (formerly known as Burma) and Thailand during the 15th and 16th centuries. The earliest reference (1411 AD) mentions a ferocious style of unarmed combat that decided the fate of the Thai kings. A later description tells how Nai Khanom Tom, Thailand's first famous boxer and a prisoner of war in Myanmar, gained his freedom by roundly defeating a dozen Burmese warriors before a Burmese court. To this day, many martial art aficionados consider the Thai style the ultimate in hand to hand fighting. Hong Kong, China, Singapore, Taiwan, Korea, Japan, USA, Germany and France have all sent their best and none of the challengers have been able to defeat top-ranked Thai Boxers. On one famous occasion, Hong Kong's top five Kung Fu masters were dispatched in less than 6 and a half minutes cumulative total, all knockouts. (note: the previous statement can be disputed at present. A check of recent history would show many USA fighters have beaten Thai fighters in title fights at Bangkok's Lumpinee Stadium. At the recent annual King's Cup 2000 in Thailand, several USA fighters from San Francisco's Fairtex Muay Thai gym beat Thai fighters. Also of note, many of the current Muay Thai world champions are not Thai fighters, e.g., Alex Gong, Jean Claude Leuyer, and George Tsutsui.)..."

[yeung]

Muay Thai :-

"...Most of what is known about the early history of Thai Boxers comes from Burmese accounts of warfare between Myanmar (formerly known as Burma) and Thailand during the 15th and 16th centuries. The earliest reference (1411 AD) mentions a ferocious style of unarmed combat that decided the fate of the Thai kings. A later description tells how Nai Khanom Tom, Thailand's first famous boxer and a prisoner of war in Myanmar, gained his freedom by roundly defeating a dozen Burmese warriors before a Burmese court. To this day, many martial art aficionados consider the Thai style the ultimate in hand to hand fighting. Hong Kong, China, Singapore, Taiwan, Korea, Japan, USA, Germany and France have all sent their best and none of the challengers have been able to defeat top-ranked Thai Boxers. On one famous occasion, Hong Kong's top five Kung Fu masters were dispatched in less than 6 and a half minutes cumulative total, all knockouts. (note: the previous statement can be disputed at present. A check of recent history would show many USA fighters have beaten Thai fighters in title fights at Bangkok's Lumpinee Stadium. At the recent annual King's Cup 2000 in Thailand, several USA fighters from San Francisco's Fairtex Muay Thai gym beat Thai fighters. Also of note, many of the current Muay Thai world champions are not Thai fighters, e.g., Alex Gong, Jean Claude Leuyer, and George Tsutsui.)..."

man, man, the reason that the five kungfu masters were knocked out is that they wore gloves and the kungfu's weapons are hands and the gloves stopped the kungfu masters from using their potential.

As for the history of Muay Thai, Muay Thai wasnt and i mean wasnt, part of thailand. the origin of Muay Thai was from cambodia and my father was a cambodian and he told me that the thais copied it from the cambodian people and the real name was Muay Khmer. there is proof of cambodian using muay khmer in the carving of the old temples in cambodia.

[foxman]

Krabi-Krabong - Muay thai

man, man, the reason that the five kungfu masters were knocked out is that they wore gloves and the kungfu's weapons are hands and the gloves stopped the kungfu masters from using their potential.

As for the history of Muay Thai, Muay Thai wasnt and i mean wasnt, part of thailand. the origin of Muay Thai was from cambodia and my father was a cambodian and he told me that the thais copied it from the cambodian people and the real name was Muay Khmer. there is proof of cambodian using muay khmer in the carving of the old temples in cambodia.

"As for the history of Muay Thai, Muay Thai wasnt and i mean wasnt, part of thailand." - this is completely untrue in my opinion as muay thai actually originated from a form of martial art that was used to defend the thai people in warfare. In fact this was called Krabi-Krabong and was founded by Prince Naresuan , Who Spent His Youth (While Being Held Hostage By The Burmese) Studying The Art Of Warfare. It involved the use of weaponry and even more complex arts like using two thai swords. Muay Thai Boxing (Or Muay Chao Chur As It Was Called Then) Was Created, because Too Many Soldiers Were Being Killed Or Injured Training With Weapons, & Although Thai Boxing Is A Devastatingly Effective Sport, It Lacks The Deadly Refinement & Efficiency Of Krabi-Krabong. The 'Black Prince' Eventually Died Around 1590 but the sport and art of muay thai lives on. i hope this has helped clear up the fact that Muay thai originated from Thailand.

[CHOPS]

what about....

What about the band that plays and dictates the tempo of the fight? How about cut kicks to the back of the leg (sciatic nerve). Also, points are awarded for throws. Mouthpiece optional and, oh yeah, The Wai Kru.
Just my 2 cents.

[akara]

The 'Black Prince' Eventually Died Around 1590 but the sport and art of muay thai lives on. i hope this has helped clear up the fact that Muay thai originated from Thailand.

Ok. But the Khmers have been practicing Badai Serei, which includes Muay Thai, since 8th century A.D., perhaps even earlier.

[yeung]

Quote Thaikicker:
"Muay Thai is Khmer and the proof is in the temples of Cambodia all carved in stone. the head band has spells (Yantra) written in khmer, the history is also written in the chinese sand scripts claiming that the khmes used fierce fighting styles. All the tatoos and the music is all khmer.
Every thing you see in Thailand is actually khmer related, the clothing, dancing, foods etc. so when you see something that's thai, it's actually khmer."

there. the thais were originately come from southern china and they fought with the Khmers before taken over part of the khmer empire and name their captive land thailand. after that, they started to learn and copy the khmer way of doing things like writing, speaking, fighting and everything but the thais changed it a little bit as to make it look like it's from their own.
i'll give you an example. can you see that the japanese's writing system is similar to the chinese writing system and also some of the fighting system are also similar, plus the culture. but you know that it all orginated from china. why can it be the same for cambodia/khmer? =/

here's a link if u care to read. http://www.leisurecambodia.com/Leisu....07/boxing.htm
so long.

[Ninja Kl0wn]

Rome conquered Greece. They took most of thier culture, philosophy, religion, and even warfare tactics from the Greeks. The phalanx style formations used by the Roman legions came from Greece. Why then, do we not jump up and start argueing that everything Roman isn't really Roman, it's actually Greek?

Who gives a flying f*** where it was originally created? It was developed and refined in Thailand, it's Thai. Just like karate. It was developed and refined in Japan, it's Japanese. BJJ came from Japan, but it was developed and refined in Brazil, therefor it's Brazilian. If you want to get really anal about this, I'm going to claim everything is an African martial art based on the "out of Africa" theory of human evolution.