What would you do?

[darrianation]

This not really a quiz, this is just to get some of you thinking, although it may make a good quiz and it does ask some questions.

The scenario!

You walk into a bar. There is this rough looking guy over in the far corner who is acting loud and obnoxious. He’s aggressive and seems to be pissed of at something. A small voice in your head tells you this guy could be dangerous.

He is becoming more rowdy now and a sudden noise makes you turn and look. Eye contact is made and he yells across the room at you “what the hell are you looking at?”

a) You don’t say anything and turn back and continue sipping your beer.
b) You say “nothing” and turn back to your beer.
c) Posture yourself act aggressive and say “f*** you.
d) You say “nothing I’m just trying to see the score of the game on the TV.

Which of these responses would least likely get you into a fight?

Okay lets say for shits and giggles you chose (d). You are now back to your beer and you sense someone behind you, you turn and there he is. He says in an aggressive manner “do you have a problem?”

a) You say “no problem just leave me alone ” and go back to your beer.
b) You say, “ Yes, you’re an asshole.
c) You stand up and go face to face and tell him “I’m going rip your f***ing head off?”
d) You say, “hey that’s a nice tattoo, I am thinking about getting one and the art work on yours is amazing, where did you get it?”

Which of these responses is least likely to get you into a fight?

Now lets say you chose you chose (d), but he is still in your face. When you first came into the bar you had assessed this guy as a possible threat. Now he has picked you out of the crowd and is postured and has made contact verbally, now he is threatening you.

So now what do you do?

a) Do you make your escape to the door?
b) Do you run to the bathroom before you piss yourself?
c) Do you wait for him to make the first move?
d) Do you kick him in the nads, and poke him in eye, clinch and throw a couple of knees?

At this point no matter what you did it would be a tough decision. At what point are you legally okay to strike, and what point do you stop caring what’s legal?

I would say no way to answer (b). I would never let someone hit me first so no (c). (a) Would be the smartest thing to do I’m sure as long as there is an open escape route to the door and of course he may pursue you and you wouldn’t want to get caught from behind.
So (d) is still left. Before I struck I would say something like I don’t want to fight you so witnesses can hear it, it may help if the police become involved (it may not).

Essay question : What would you do and why?

[choylifutrocks]

(1) D, (2) D, (3)Hard choice between A and D. Once somebody aggressive enters my "personal zone", as my grammar school teachers so nicely put it, I really want to just disable them, at the least. I wouldn't wanna turn by back TO walk away.

[Thai Bri]

Sorry. Couldn't take your quiz.

I left and went to a nicer bar before you got to ask the first question. Honest.

[S.Anucha]

Sorry. Couldn't take your quiz.

I left and went to a nicer bar before you got to ask the first question. Honest.

very smart reply! and very smart move if it were real, who knows how drugged up he is or how prepared he is to kill.

[Thai Bri]

Thanks. I don't want people to think I was taking the pi55 either. That would easily be the best thing to do. Leave your ego at home. That way you can be sure you still have one at the end of the night.

[darrianation]

Yah I guess if you totally stay out of bars you are good to go. One thing you know for sure there will always be a drunk there (at the bar). For that matter you shouldn't go to the store either because someone there may be drunk too, I see drunks and people on meth’ or who knows what all the time in the parking lot.

Hey wait a minute where can you be safe? Maybe the library, no wait that’s next to the park and people drink at the park, hum people do drugs at the park, okay maybe that’s not safe either. I guess I’ll just stay home pull the drapes and order out food the rest of my life. Paranoia will destroy ya’

Seriously though if the person in the hypothetical scenario left earlier before it came to that then every thing would of been fine. However you can't go around living in fear either. If you left the places you went every time someone looked at you wrong, or were a little rowdy then you'll be stuck at home a lot and I wouldn't want to live like that.

[Sean Dempsey]

By "identifying" him as a threat, you created a self-fulfilling prophecy and caused the fight yourself.

[IPON]

By "identifying" him as a threat, you created a self-fulfilling prophecy and caused the fight yourself.

I think Sean make s a good point. SD should not be based on neurosis or anxiety, but somethingtangible or based on real and immediate circumstance. When I eneter a room or get on the train I look at everyone this type of peoprson that type of person, I think every MA does but unless somone is attacking me or about to there is no cuase for alarm. Now in the last part, I would probably ignore the people if they touched me or tried to prevent me from leaving that is a differnt story. Barring the issue of drugs, most people regardless of size and skill do not have alot of heart. I am speaking of the agressors they usually have collective heart 2-3+ friends and now you are a "tough guy".

Everyone knows true tough guys don't announce it (unless they are on PPV)

[choylifutrocks]

There have been many good points here, and TB you did make the best decision. However, in his set scenario he did not offer the option to enter the bar or not. So, just for the sake of playing the game, what would you do in that situation? I think that is what he is wondering about.

Good points though. I personally despise drugs and alcohol and am the last person on earth you will find in a bar. I'd rather find something more constructive to do with my time--no offense to any bar hoppers. I wasted my share of time, now I'm trying to make up for the difference.

[darrianation]

Look guys it's not that I disagree with your assertions cause' I do agree with them. I agree with Thai as well, definitely the smartest thing to do.

I was doing a walk through scenario and all options are yours. You can leave at any point, John Doe in this story didn't. However it can have been- you walked into the bar, sat down and ordered a beer. As you sat drinking your beer you heard a sudden and loud noise coming from behind you on the far side of the bar and as you turned and looked eye contact is made and so on. However there are options throughout this scenario you are not limited to exact flow of it.

Awareness, and the threat assessment skills that TB used have saved him from confrontation, we all should learn. However something tells me TB would have thumped the guy then taken him to jail. C’mon TB admit it?

Anyway I was hoping people here would take this scenario to the end because I am interested in a couple of things. I know TB is a cop so I would be interested in his opinion here (I know laws are different from place to place but there some commonalities too). I am also interested in all of your opinions.

Barring leaving as soon as you suspected there might be trouble. Lets say it was more sudden like the scenario I just gave above at what point would you be legally justified in striking? Or should you try to run away knowing he could get you from behind? Or is anything else at the end of this scenario that could be said or done before it became violent? If you have certain physical techniques you would use at this point I would like to know them too.

My opinion is at this point when the bad guy is standing there and is posturing and threatening you, you have two options 1) Run for you life. But he could hit you from behind, or tackle you from behind. 2) Fight.

[darrianation]

As far as statements I made earlier about paranoia: I tell people to listen to themselves and if they think something is wrong then they are probably right. Listen to that little voice. I say this all the time, but don’t get carried away with paranoia. I say this because there are very few bars or other places I go to where there isn’t some one who is drunk and rowdy, or acting cocky to one extent or another. This usually doesn’t cause problems except for some annoyance maybe. If you left every time there might be a possible problem then like I said before you might as well give up and become a hermit.

I don’t want other people or their behaviors dictate to me where I can go and what I can do. Some times the risks are worth the benefits. However this isn’t to say you should look for trouble, you need to use common sense and weigh the benefits of getting out of the house and having a good time against the risks. The decisions can be big ones at times. You need to know when to leave but at the same time don’t let paranoia get the best of you.

[Thai Bri]

OK, perhaps I'm in there and alot of my friends and family are. Maybe they're a bit merry and unwilling to go, not acknowledging the danger.

I'm staying sober and alert. I'm watching out for all my loved ones, and I'm making plans. I'm looking at the surroundings - exits, any CCTV, possibly improvised weapons. I'm looking at people - does he have many friends in the place? I'm imagining a few scenarios before they happen, along with what I'd do about them.

If I can't defuse trouble, and it does go on the verge of being physical, I'm going in pre-emptively. And he's booking a ticket to the Hospital.

I was on one forum where a guy had this great trick. There was someone in a place who he acrtively wanted to batter, but he didn't want the legal fall out. So, as the guy was taking a drink, the forum member grabbed the hands that was holding the glass, shouted "Please don't glass me! Please!", and then proceeded to beat the shit out of him. The witnesses saw ourt creative friend as defending himself. Like I said, I didn't see it done, but what a cool trick......