Gun Confiscation Now Beginning in California

[Ronin]

LMAO!

Thanks, Ryu! I was getting a little serious there for a bit.

It's too bad Rickson wasn't in the Colombine area during the shootings. He could have used his super-speed to pluck the bullets out of the air, and his heat vision to melt the barrels!

Cleatus:

Your point is taken about killers being killers, but it's easier to regulate guns than to regulate people. It may be a necessary evil. That's all I'm saying.

Let's agree to disagree, for now. I'm tired of arguing.

Peace, bro.

[Cleatus Ledbetter]

It is always nice to debate an issue with a reasonable person. The truth probably lies somewhere in the middle of both of our positions.

Peace to you Brother Ronin

Cleatus "Master of my Domain" Ledbetter

[John Bennett]

BE PROUD that you hate guns.

This stern warning lets criminals know that you take gun control seriously!

Print it on adhesive lables to make stickers.

That way you can show your gun control pride by placing them on

- the window of your car
- the windows of your house
- make a placard for your front yard
- makes a dandy sew-on patch for you winter coat.
- display it proudly on the front door of your apartment.





BE PROUD! SAY IT LOUD!

[Ryu (non-working password]

LOL
I don't want to get involved in this debate, but I am trying my best to bite my tongue at that last post.

Ryu

[Newbie]

---Ronin

All of this does not change the fact that you don't have to be an expert on a given subject to have a valid opionion and the way you chose to challenge J. B.'s opinion was to ask him if he was an expert.


"Furthermore, whether AmeriCORPS is beneficial or not, it is clearly not a DETRIMENT to society."

If AmeriCORPS is not beneficial, it is a detriment to society because it then becomes wasteful spending.

"A gun is lethal up to 100 yards, and requires no skill to operate, just an index finger."

Actually, a firearm can be lethal up to a lot more than 100 yards. A high-level sniper can consistently kill someone up to 1,000 yards away, although 200 yards is a pretty long shot for most hunters. I have heard that there have been documented cases of snipers killing individuals up to a mile away.

"It takes years of training to kill someone with martial arts technique, and still isn't easy.

A knife can be deadly, but only within a few feet."

I'm sure you have heard about the Oklahoma City bombing where fertilizer was used to create an explosion that killed more people than any crazed gunman in history.

A man operating a concession stand at a football game could slip a slow acting poison in his soda pop that did not display any symptoms until it was too late and probably kill quite a few people. In fact, he'd have a much better chance of getting away with it than if he had used a firearm. I've always thought that this could be done at a kegger. The people that drank a lot and started puking and passing out might be mistaken for being intoxicated.

Imagine if two men slipped machetes into their trench coats and walked into a kindergarten schoolroom. They close the door behind them and one stood stands there blocking it while the other runs through hacking the children to death.

Any bus driver could drive off a cliff and kill his entire passenger load.

[Ronin]

Who says you can't face multiple attackers?

Once more unto the breach.

Guns for self-defense. Hmmm, let's analyze this:

Have you ever been mugged? I haven't. If I was, I would give them my money.

Do you live in a crummy neighborhood? I don't. If I did, and could afford a gun, I would be better off purchasing locks and iron bars for my windows, or better yet, move.

Would a gun make me feel safe? No. It would make me paranoid, and more likely to blow away Girl Scouts selling cookies than an actual intruder.

Are guns consistently used to thwart crimes? Not that I've heard. I thought that was the job of the cops.

Are people safe in societies without guns? Overwhelmingly, yes.


You guys keep setting up straw-men and knocking them down. People do NOT use guns on a regular basis to defend themselves. In fact, most people are rarely attacked, including most of the members of the NRA. Guns are most often used to INITIATE attacks - duh, they are offensive, not defensive. And if someone decides to kill you, drawing your gun and shooting them is probably not within the skill-level of most gun owners.

You guys just like your guns, and don't want to give them up. Kids like the Colombine victims, and many many others, are "acceptable losses" to you selfish extremists.

Well, guess what? When kids are involved, there are no "acceptable losses". Start compromising, before you get ALL your rights taken away. If the gun lobby worked FOR gun control, the situation would improve dramatically.

Newbie:

It is preferable to have studied a subject in-depth before you start pontificating about it. I stand by my statement, and welcome John to prove me wrong - that he really doesn't know much about AmeriCORPS besides the fact that it is a government program, started by Clinton, and he therefore doesn't like it.

[Lacrymosa]

Right on, Ro!

Lacrymosa
-Never been mugged
-Never been shot at
-Has been reared to believe that guns are dangerous and not worth owning
-Never fired a gun in his life
-Never owned a gun in his life
-Has been threatened with a gun ONCE in his lifetime......by an NRA enthusiast.......

-Still Alive

[Ronin]

Nice to know SOMEONE agrees with me!

This lone warrior bit can get a little draining.

[bobby_steeles]

well ronin, one night when you're half asleep in bed and you hear 3 guys breaking into your house, you don't have to worry about reaching for a gun, just open up your legs nice and wide and wait for the guy to jump into your guard. that's "defensive", isn't it?

A LOT of people who study martial arts will never get into a fight in their lives. the few that do, afterwards, will thank god that they had spent all that time training for that exact, brief moment in their lives that they needed it.

[Badger]

[i]Originally posted by Ronin [/i.]
Are guns consistently used to thwart crimes? Not that I've heard. I thought that was the job of the cops.
[/B]

So someone tries to break into your house you will call men with guns?

Most people I know who own guns Know how to use them just as well if not better than the police.

I also know people who have defended themselves with guns.

My police officer friends also agree with citizens learning to defend themselves whether it be firearms,martial arts as long as it's with awareness.

I don't know about statistics but thats the people I know!

Peace!
-Badger

[Lacrymosa]

Such paranoia would convince me to invest in some sort of alarm/security system rather than a semi-automatic firearm to blow someone's head off.

Lacrymosa
-Lived in a "bad" neighborhood for eleven years and never been burglarized.

[Mickey Finn]

If you are counting on the police to protect you, you are in for a very rude awakening. Check the response times in your neighborhood. The cops (through no fault of their own) are primarily there to clean up the mess AFTER it occurs. They are great for drawing chalk lines around your body, taking beautiful 8 X 10’s of your corpse, maybe catching the guy and hopefully building a case for the DA to prosecute the perpetrator. I don’t know about you, but the thought of a neat chalk line around my (or my loved ones) body, some bitchen photos and a convicted criminal brings me little comfort if I am DEAD.

Ronnin, you need to do some research. And you need to be very conscious of where you are getting your stats from and what the possible motivations of those compiling the stats might be. I don’t care to get into this with you; suffice it to say that you are regurgitating some seriously flawed information.

The much vaunted numbers provided by the Brady bunch about guns in the house being more likely to be used against you than be used in your defense are pure BS. Do you know how the numbers were compiled? First off, they lined up all the times a gun was used in self-defense versus all the times a gun was used against its owner. The numbers favored the defensive use of firearms substantially. So how did they fix that? First they eliminated all the cases where a gun owner meets a threat “brandishing” a weapon and the perp flees. (The most common application of self-defense with a firearm) The numbers still didn’t come out the way they wanted. Next they eliminate all the times gun owners shoot and wound a perp. Still didn’t come out the way they wanted. They finally said unless you shoot and kill the perp it is not a legitimate case of firearm self defense (at least as far as Hand Gun Control Inc is concerned) Still didn’t like the numbers. So, the next thing they did was include suicides by handgun in the stats. (IMO that is BS. There are a million ways to kill yourself, and if a man wants to end it all, IMO, that should be his right. It’s “his life” after all isn’t it?) It goes on. I can’t provide you with links etc. to back this up. There was a time when I was a fence sitter and I decided to do MY OWN research and look at the numbers and how they were compiled. These are some of the things I found for myself. I heartily recommend it. I suggest reading something compiled by a criminologist of your choice instead of a politician or a Hollywood star.

As far as never having needed a gun to defend yourself, that’s great. I have also never needed the seat belts in my car. That doesn’t mean I don’t use them. When you DO need a gun for self defense……. you will need it bad, just like that seat belt.

My secretary went out to the mailbox one day and came running back into the office white as a sheet. She told me a man was coming into the lobby wearing a full ski mask. (In costal California) I have a .45 in a desk drawer. I retrieved the weapon and headed to our front door. It opened and a man wearing a Raiders jacket and a ski mask came through the door as he was reaching into his waistband. He looked up and I had him center of mass. He reversed himself went running out the door, into the parking lot, picked up a ten speed bike and rode away as fast as he could go up the street toward the rail road tracks. (Notice this story would NOT be considered a successful self-defense use of a firearm because I never fired the weapon, nor did I kill the perp) I reported the incident to the police. 1 week later some detectives visited me. It seems a guy on a ten-speed bike, wearing a ski mask rolled up next to a janitor on his way home from cleaning one of the local buildings. (This was about a ½ mile on the other side of the RR tracks) He rolled up on the guy at a stop sign and shot him in the head and emptied his wallet and rode away. He was never caught.

One more thing, when my sister was still alive, and she was being stalked, we had the police over at the house a number of times. We believed, as do you, that the police will protect you. It was a wake up call when of them pulled me aside and told me, “this is off the record, I never told you this, but buy her a gun, teach her how to use it and have her carry it. He’s going to kill her and we can’t stop it.” I bought her a S&W bodyguard, had it retrofitted with a 3” barrel and some decent grips. She refused it on moral grounds. I don’t know if that gun would have saved her, but I will think “what if…………..” for the rest of my life. May you NEVER have to do the same.

[EJ]

"As far as never having needed a gun to defend yourself, that’s great. I have also never needed the seat belts in my car. That doesn’t mean I don’t use them. When you DO need a gun for self defense……. you will need it bad, just like that seat belt."

That brought a tear to my eye... check yer email.

[Lacrymosa]

Oh brother....

Here they come, Ronin.

I haven't counted on a lousy gun to save me for my entire life....and I'm doing just fine. In fact, I have yet to meet an individual who's been "rescued from the jaws of hell and damnation" by a lousy firearm in a time of tension........except for a few Vietnam Vets that I've spoken to.

I HAVE, however, met an individual from my wife's family whose 5-year-old son's life was accidentally ended when he found "Daddy's New Toy".

[EJ]

One of my best friends, a groomsman in my wedding, is a LAPD officer of high standing.

He says that I should pack heat in my car (I work in a ****ed up area) because "It's better to be caught with it than without it."

I don't... but the day some asshole ****s me up or stabs me, I will wish I did.