Silat Mubai: Muslim Silat Combatives

[Makkhatter]

aeight, I give. Your right, we haven't had anywhere near the losses we would have in a real war. It's frustrating over here though. I'd love it if our enemy would stand up and fight back. It's the randomness of it all that makes it bad. You've got a valid point. Me, I'll keep taking it personaly everytime someone close to me goes down. But I see your point.

My odds of coming home are definetly better than my grandfather's were, although he made it home. Good luck, I'll sure if you've reenlisted, you'll end up over here soon enough.

Watch the median

[kerambit]

Loss rate

One thing I'd point out here is that the war isn't over yet, not by a long shot. We've had 2000 dead SO FAR. As the insurgency grew in Indochina, our casualty rates went up. In Iraq, the insurgency is getting stronger by the day and not weakening.

Many of our top military brass are now calling this an unwinnable war.

If that's the case, the number of lives we throw down the toilet over there don't matter at all.

The latest hilarity from the White House has to do with employing air power and pulling back troops.

What troop concentrations do they want to bomb? Maybe some mosques? Maybe Al-Jazeera?

That will help.

Once again the united states has failed to export democracy at gunpoint. When are you people ever going to learn???

[Makkhatter]

Iraq does seem to be a great buffer zone for terrorists. All sorts of middle eastern terrorists are coming from different countries to attack us. At least as long as they do it in Iraq, they're fighting trained soldiers, instead of killing the people I've sworn to protect. And the insurgent causulties are a hell of a lot higher than the Coalition forces. As long as the terrorists are distracted by the war in Iraq - I'll stay. It's better than having them attack us at home.

[Ustaz Hussein]

Replies and Clarifications

Hello Gentleman,

I'm Ustaz Hussein Udom, the head trainer for Silat Mubai International. This thread came to my attention earlier today through a friend and I wish to address some of the misconceptions about myself, our organization, religion and Military culture.

As a professional Teacher part of my job is to educate, in the English language, people on what is true and what is false regarding the Muslim Military Arts and Warrior culture. I'm not here for arguing, backstabbing or any sort of mud slinging but rather as an informed guest who is willing to share information aboiut what you are discussing.

I wish to address your post first Mr.Brewer as you are a Military trained individual and have obviously taken the time to analyze the SMI site.

"Mubai seems to teach mainstream arts that you can find at any FMA school that teaches the arts I listed earlier. What concerns me is the fact that until people started "wondering" online about their aims, there was no disclaimer on that site."

Yes, what we teach is no secret to anyone involved in Southeast Asian fighting arts. The main difference is that we emphasize the Islamic traditions of Futawa (Chivalry) which accompanied Military training since the time of our Prophet, peace be upon him. As an educated man I'm sure you know that most of the places where Silat comes from are Muslim lands, so why the surprise that we teach our Chivalry with it? The only real difference between us and them is that we teach it in English to all who wish to learn. In the native countries they teach in their own tongue, and usually only to Muslims. That probably explains why most Westerners identify Silat primarily with Christian and Hindu influences like Serak and Bhukti Negara, which are taught openly in Western countries.

As for the issue of the disclaimer, we put it up because people wanted to know and we got tired of people asking about it. The terrorism statement makes things clear for all. Simple as that.



"Another thing that concerned me was the content of their video. They spent the first five minutes or so demonstrating their tools (which were about as Arab as I am). I know they don't say they're Arab, and I know that Arab and Muslim are different things, so no problem there. But the last two and a half minutes of the video is footage of various Arab countries and locations, old ladies sitting at a table sorting out bullets, etc. Those images suggest that there's more of a message than may meet the casual eye."

The "tools" Mr.Brewer belong to ALL MUSLIMS. It is very important as an analyst to know the culture, religion and mentality of those you wish to analyze. When you make statements like this you show very little knowledge of who we are. When a Muslim makes something or does something, then that thing is for all Muslims, not just for his specific tribe or nation. This is the teaching of the Qur'an and the Prophet Muhamad, peace be upon him. The Silat Arts which are Muslim belong to all Muslims and therefore we can put Arabic or Malay or Turkish people next to it without anyone saying a word about it. That's our culture and the teachings of our religion, it doesn't mean that we don't respect those who made the arts. We just see things in a different way than you do, and for us the Islamic Nation at large is above the individual.


"I'm not saying that these guys are bad people. I'm not saying their arts are bad either. I am also not saying that their being Muslim is a negative in any sense at all. What I don't like about the messages I see are things like "Capture/Kill" on their logo (what the hell does any civilian need with an art designed to do that?"

We have never ever claimed to be a self defense system so there is no need to make everything acceptable for civilians. Silat Mubai is Military Combatives and nothing more. There are civilian applications as we teach a force progression from command presence to lethal force so it is applicable to diverse situations but never have we claimed to be a self defense art for civilians. This criticism of being too aggressive is wrongly placed.


"I don't like the idea that Middle Eastern politics appear to be so closely tied with the self-defense art they claim to teach. That's not where the arts are from, and the cultures that developed the arts they teach have never, ever used them in the Middle East, so why is that such a prominent part of their marketing?"

Again, we do not teach self defense nor have we ever taught self defense. We teach Islamic Military Combatives, Al-Funoon (arts) Al-Askariya (Military) Al-Islamiya (Islamic). As for the issue of different cultures, I mentioned this earlier, that from the Muslim perspective all things made by Muslims belong to the Islamic Nation and its people. Not one country or tribe. Therefore it is no problem for a brother in Malaysia to learn Silat from a brother who is an Arab. Tribalism is irrelavent and against Islam, and those Muslims you see who are tribal oriented and make issues of other Muslims ethnicity are usually not very religiously inclined. They have no support from the Qur'an or the teaching of the Prophet, peace be upon him, for their misguided positions.


"I also don't like the overtones of conversion that go along with the "Muslim Warrior" approach. On their site, they talk about the code of honor among the mujahideen and fedayeen (both strictly military terms that describe soldiers and not civilian martial artists). I am led to believe that this school will only teach Muslims (a striking difference between it and any art that uses principles from Buddhism or Taoism or Shinto or whatever to point out where things came from)"

There are no overtones of conversion as we lead by example and Islam needs nothing more than excellent examples through its Warriors. In the second Sura or the Qur'an Allah says "There is no compulsion in religion.", so again if you see Muslims trying to coerce or force others to accept Islam, they are misguided and in the wrong.

The Futawa (Chivalry) we teach is functional for all people at all times. They are deep seeded codes of honour and justice that no man at arms should be deprived of. I have never and will never try to convert people to Islam. I try my best to provide an excellent example of what a Muslim Warrior is as taught to us by the Warrior Prophet (pbuh) thorugh his Military Sunnah (Military Tradition). All who accept Islam due to this example have had their hearts guided to it by God, not me.

As for the issue of the terminology "Fedayeen" and "Mujahideen", yes they are purely Military but then again so is everything in Islamic Warrior culture. Our Prophet, peace be upon him, was a Soldier and so were 95% of his companions. There is no "civilian" way of expressing these terms. A Muslim who fights for the Islamic Nation is a Mujahid (Warrior), there is no other word suitable. In English there is a separation of "Martial Arts" from "Military Combatives", no such separation exists in the Arabic language.


"From my background I can conclude two things - First and Foremost: I am assuming everything I just wrote. It is not truth, but opinion. Take it as such."

From your background I would expect an educated and researched opinion rather than random talk. Why would you want to speak so negatively about people when you know so little about them? do you do the same against the Bhuddists and the Sikhs? Please research our website fully and learn about our Military culture and religion before making such uninformed statements. It is far beneath your stated background to do so.


"Second: If I were looking to recruit for the wrong side, these guys would be a prime spot to look."

No we're not. We are the worst spot to look, and you of all people should know that. Those who are doing things wrong and are misguided i.e. Al Qaeda types know full well that the traditional Islaimic Military teachings do not and have never condoned assaults on civilian targets, vegetation, food supply or anything else related to non-combatants during Military operations. The Shariah (Islamic law) strictly prohibits such attacks.

Strapping a bomb on yourself and running into an enemy convoy is what a real Mujahid does. Strapping a bomb on yourself and blowing up a shopping mall in Tel Aviv is what a severely misguided and mentally deranged individual will do. Do not confuse terrorism in the name of Islam with legitimate Military operations in defence of Islam and Muslims simply because you dislike the Mujahid's method of delivery.


"How many will take the fantasy world of honorable fedayeen to heart more quickly than the self-defense aspect? How many people does that offer up as fodder for people that might misuse those perceptions?"

There is no fantasy in the Fedayeen or Mujahideen, Sir. These very "honourable" practices have been in our community for 1500 years with a documented history of application in countless battles. From The Prophet (pbuh) to Saladin to Umar Mukhtar, may Allah be pleased with them, traditional Islamic Military codes of Chivalry have shown their just and true nature. Even against the worst of enemies we have proven that our honour is above revenge and murder. The Prophet (pbuh) watched his own uncle killed and his belly slit open and his heart cut out in the battle of Uhud. When he later caught the perpetrators in Mecca he pardoned them to show that the "honourable" codes are far above the barbarism that was common in pre-Islamic Arabia.

That is real Islamic Military honour , Sir.

Those criminals who look like us, talk like us, dress like us and proceed to blow up children and ladies have no part in that honour.

"All I'm saying is that I don't like the approach, the marketing, or the messages I've seen so far. I won't repeat rumors, because they're just that and I have no proof of anything, but this is what I have seen from their materials."

You are fully enitled to your opinion Sir, but I implore you to learn before you make statements about people and things you don't know.

Anyone who wishes to reach me for comments or criticism is free to do so at admin@mubai.cc

Or post your replies here. I'd be happy to answer them.

Respectfully,

Ustaz Hussein Udom
Chief Tactical Trainer
Silat Mubai International

https://www.mubai.cc

Silat Tarab Combatives
Military / Law Enforcement / Civilian

https://www.starab.org

[Tom Yum]

Strapping a bomb on yourself and running into an enemy convoy is what a real Mujahid does. Strapping a bomb on yourself and blowing up a shopping mall in Tel Aviv is what a severely misguided and mentally deranged individual will do. Do not confuse terrorism in the name of Islam with legitimate Military operations in defence of Islam and Muslims simply because you dislike the Mujahid's method of delivery.

Marhabba, Ustaz Hussein.

You're very first line represents a very, very slippery slope.

A young, impressionable and misguided youth could take these things the wrong way and do the wrong thing.

Sun Tzu says that war is about deception. Where is the boundary between legitimate military operations in defence of Islam and down-right terrorism begin?

[Ustaz Hussein]

Clarification

Greetings Mr.Yum,

Tom Yum Wrote:

"A young, impressionable and misguided youth could take these things the wrong way and do the wrong thing."

Impossible Sir. Those misguided Muslims with terrorist intentions make it very clear that ANY assault on non-combatants is acceptable to them. Whether by firearms, explosives, or any other delivery system no matter how non-conventional i.e. airplanes etc.

I see many young impressionable youths as part of my job as a trainer. I make it very clear to these youths that terrorism is impermissable and give proper proofs from the Qur'an, teachings of the Prophet (pbuh), and Islamic Military history to support it. None of them has ever come away with anything less than respect for human life and a clear understanding of target discrimination. I only offer traditional Islamic Military teachings, nothing more. And it is very clear when it comes to the issue of killing non-combatants. It is 100% impermissable as a regulation coming from the Prophet Muhamad (pbuh) himself in times of warfare.

"Sun Tzu says that war is about deception. Where does terrorism in the name of Islam differ from legitimate military operations in defence of Islam?"

How does terrorism in the name of American ideology differ from legitimate operations in defence of the American homeland?

There is a big difference.

It's easy to point fingers at others and say things but put it into your own home and see what you would do. If Muslims fight against US occupation forces in Iraq isn't that to be expected when foreigners invade a land? Would you not do the same thing if we occupied San Francisco? surely you would.

Does that mean you are a terrorist, surely not, and so Muslims who fight against invasion forces in their lands with legitimate methods against valid Military targets are not terrorists either. They are Mujahideen defending their land, religion, honour and families from foreign forces.

Those people who attack non-combatants in hotels, malls, and markets, they are the terrorists. There is a huge difference between a terrorist and a Warrior Sir.

As I mentioned in my previous post Sir, don't give false labels to Warriors simply because you dislike their method of delivering an attack against an enemy target. Were the Japanese Kamikazee planes also terrorists when they died colliding with enemy forces?

When an American Soldier gives his life in a legitimate battle he is a hero. So why the double standards to call a Muslim Soldier who dies fighting in a legitimate battle a terrorist?

Mr.Yum, the method of delivery is irrelevant. Only the intended target can define an action in such a situation as terrorist.

Regards,

Ustaz Hussein

[BoarSpear]

Sounds like he wants it perfectly clear he doesnt train civilians, he trains Muslim warriors. Im glad he makes sure the guidance systems on the human bombs dont get confused and wander into a malls or schools .

[Ustaz Hussein]

Clarifications

Sounds like he wants it perfectly clear he doesnt train civilians, he trains Muslim warriors. Im glad he makes sure the guidance systems on the human bombs dont get confused and wander into a malls or schools .

Hi Sir,

I train anyone who wishes to learn. Half my students are not Muslims and I also teach Silat Tarab which is a purely Combatives oriented system with nothing else to it.

Regards,

Ustaz Hussein

[BoarSpear]

Hi Sir,

I train anyone who wishes to learn. Half my students are not Muslims and I also teach Silat Tarab which is a purely Combatives oriented system with nothing else to it.

Regards,

Ustaz Hussein

I gotcha the first time

[Uke]

amen Mike...if you are a source of income to my enemies, YOU are my enemy and likely to be attacked............. cutting supply lines is simply good strategy.

I don't know how I missed this topic. Its great with great things being said. But I highlighted that particular quote from BoarSpear for a reason. Forgive me if this has already been mentioned, as I only read the first page of this topic at the time of this response. It says "If you are a source of income to my enemies, YOU are my enemy, etc".

Well, it seems like we are speaking about terrorists. But let us not forget how these "terrorists came to be. When the Holocaust survivors were offered a land of their own, they were offered many different locations. They insisted on Canaan, which was then occupied by the Palestinians. The Palestinians were then driven out of Canaan, and Canaan was renamed Israel on May 15, 1948, and occupied by European convert Jews who had never occupied that region before in history. Ever since that time, a conflict has been ongoing in that region. And the real reason that the Arabs who fight against Israel are our enemies today is because we(the USA) sponsor Israel in this conflict with money, weapons, and rations, among other things.

So if the statement "If you are a source of income to my enemies, YOU are my enemy" holds true, its because the US and other countries at the tail end of WWII created that conflict by once again putting our noses in foreign affairs that didn't concern us. When we pushed the Palestinians out of Canaan and funded the newly formed nation of Israel so that they could keep their recently acquired land, we became the enemies of Palestine. That's the exact point in time when we, the American people, became the targets of terror attacks.

We've all seen the pictures of Palestinians throwing rocks and sticks at tanks. That is just one instance of one side having the means, while the other doesn't, but the conflict goes on anyway.

Now I'm not in the slightest trying to condone anything. I'm just saying that I know some people don't know the history of why this conflict started and why it has continued to become what it is today. They like American Indians, were wrongfully slaughtered and misplaced, but unlike the Indians, these people refuse to ever stop fighting until they have back what they feel is theirs.

I am aware of Prescott Bush's laundering of Nazi money. But what role do you think Bush Sr. played as Director of the CIA? As director he had agents constantly in that region under the guise of intelligence for "war purposes". Let's be real about this. The Middle East is not a super power as far as military power or economics. Its sole importance to the global community is oil. So why is so much attention placed on the Middle East every couple of years? Because a conflict there justifies sending troops. However the American troops aren't there to protect the US soil, as America is thousand of miles away. American troops aren't there to catch war criminals. America created and trained Saddam and Bin Laden and the groups that they are affiliated with. We(the USA) trained them to fight for our agendas, and now that they no longer do, they are somehow more evil than the men who's agenda they once served.

Isn't that nice and convenient?

You can't have a war without an enemy. Manufactured or otherwise.

[Tom Yum]

We? Are you not an American? Why did they not fight Saddam? Was he not an oppressor of muslims as well? Why do honorable muslims there and elsewhere stand for oppressors and tyrants who pervert the holy Q'uran and allow themselves to be forced to live in poverty and need? Why is it that when a muslim ruler like Mahmoud Ahmadenijad comes to power, with aims of wiping whole civilizations off the face of the planet, honorable and peaceful muslims abide this? Why do they now fight and kill each other? As much violence between muslims exists in Iraq as exists between muslim and non-muslim there. Sunnis kill Shiites, Wahabbis kill both, and foreign mercenaries kill whomever they get paid to kill. You clearly do not see yourself as an American first, as evidenced by your quote above. So what does that make you? If not a loyal American, then what? A teacher and trainer of fedayeen and mujahid, living in an infidel land? Please, please, please - explain this in better detail because I am farther from understanding than I was before your clarification. At least, I hope I am. I say "hope" because the only other option is that I am understanding even better, and that would be a sad, sad thing indeed.

Exactly.

Its absolutely friggin amazing that someone can support a cause that's thinly veiled with terrorism in our country, while living here and still have rights. I'm not saying Islam is thinly vieled terrorism; its not - its a religious right. Religious rights. Communication rights.

We're free. That's why gazillions of people want to come here. But you still choose to support a cause that would only tighten your freedoms.

What would happen in Iraq if one decides to persue the Christian faith? Apostasis?

[Koma1]

E

What would happen in Iraq if one decides to persue the Christian faith? Apostasis?

What would happen in Iraq if one decided to train Christian warriors?

[BoarSpear]

I don't know how I missed this topic. Its great with great things being said. But I highlighted that particular quote from BoarSpear for a reason. Forgive me if this has already been mentioned, as I only read the first page of this topic at the time of this response. It says "If you are a source of income to my enemies, YOU are my enemy, etc".

Well, it seems like we are speaking about terrorists. But let us not forget how these "terrorists came to be. When the Holocaust survivors were offered a land of their own, they were offered many different locations. They insisted on Canaan, which was then occupied by the Palestinians. The Palestinians were then driven out of Canaan, and Canaan was renamed Israel on May 15, 1948, and occupied by European convert Jews who had never occupied that region before in history. Ever since that time, a conflict has been ongoing in that region. And the real reason that the Arabs who fight against Israel are our enemies today is because we(the USA) sponsor Israel in this conflict with money, weapons, and rations, among other things.

So if the statement "If you are a source of income to my enemies, YOU are my enemy" holds true, its because the US and other countries at the tail end of WWII created that conflict by once again putting our noses in foreign affairs that didn't concern us. When we pushed the Palestinians out of Canaan and funded the newly formed nation of Israel so that they could keep their recently acquired land, we became the enemies of Palestine. That's the exact point in time when we, the American people, became the targets of terror attacks.

We've all seen the pictures of Palestinians throwing rocks and sticks at tanks. That is just one instance of one side having the means, while the other doesn't, but the conflict goes on anyway.

Now I'm not in the slightest trying to condone anything. I'm just saying that I know some people don't know the history of why this conflict started and why it has continued to become what it is today. They like American Indians, were wrongfully slaughtered and misplaced, but unlike the Indians, these people refuse to ever stop fighting until they have back what they feel is theirs.

I am aware of Prescott Bush's laundering of Nazi money. But what role do you think Bush Sr. played as Director of the CIA? As director he had agents constantly in that region under the guise of intelligence for "war purposes". Let's be real about this. The Middle East is not a super power as far as military power or economics. Its sole importance to the global community is oil. So why is so much attention placed on the Middle East every couple of years? Because a conflict there justifies sending troops. However the American troops aren't there to protect the US soil, as America is thousand of miles away. American troops aren't there to catch war criminals. America created and trained Saddam and Bin Laden and the groups that they are affiliated with. We(the USA) trained them to fight for our agendas, and now that they no longer do, they are somehow more evil than the men who's agenda they once served.

Isn't that nice and convenient?

You can't have a war without an enemy. Manufactured or otherwise.

Hey!! no twistin my words into my own argument (different thread) but i agree, when you choose to support/supply someones enemy, YOU become their enemy by default. But surely you aint implyin that we manufactured any enemies....EVER, not the U.S.A!

[Ustaz Hussein]

Replies

Hello Gentlemen,

Thank you very much for your replies and comments. I'm a bit busy with family issues as it's sunday but I will do my best to reply to your posts today, God Willing.

Mr.Brewer, thanks for the email. I will address your questions on the forum aswell, Sir.

Talk to you soon,

Ustaz Hussein

[BoarSpear]

Hello Gentlemen,

Thank you very much for your replies and comments. I'm a bit busy with family issues as it's sunday but I will do my best to reply to your posts today, God Willing.

Mr.Brewer, thanks for the email. I will address your questions on the forum aswell, Sir.

Talk to you soon,

Ustaz Hussein

Enjoy your time with your family, I look forward to learning more about your System.