Wing Chun or Muay Thai

[Tameo]

Wing Chun or Muay Thai

Wing Chun of corse!! Muay Thai just has way to many openings. i mean their stance with those arms like that is too open.

[HuSanYan]

I think muay thai sucks.
the only thing muay thai fighters have ever proved to me is that they are all mouth. Knee this, elbow that, blah blah blah! In my experience, muay thai is only effective against muay thai and boxing. (no offence). Trust me, Fustrated, Stick with wing chun.
Study muay thai if you want to learn to dance with the Rockets on broadway.

although a bit extreme a statement, excellent post in one sense, demonstrative of an individual thinker vs. 'follow the sheep'........however it must be said that MT is effective in reality as is WC minus the knock kneed stance
HuSanYan has spoken

[Thai Bri]

Has a good Wing Chun fighter ever beaten a good Thai Boxer? Or, indeed, a good pratitioner from almost any other style?

[HuSanYan]

Yes, I believe that there have been some pure WC guys that have beaten MT under full MT rules, I do not, however have their names or dates to hand and would have to trawl the net to find them but I have read and heard that this is true.
It really comes down to the actual people involved almost regardless of style, maybe the cases that i have heard of were situations, for example, where there were some very good WC practitioners vs. bad MT practitioners or vice versa......its down to the individual NOT style vs style, this is particularly true in real combat where its basically the 1st guy to grab/gouge/stab or strike accurately that wins basically

[krys]

Or, indeed, a good pratitioner from almost any other style?

Yes it happens... In northern Malaysia there are (illegal) matches between Thai fighters and silat&kuntao (south east asian kung fu) experts.


The filipino national yaw-yan champion Emiliano Zapata (over 105 fights, undefeated) beat a bunch of MT fighters in marches under MT rules....

[Thai Bri]

What always amazes me is the fact that people always find reasons for being unable to find proof. Its like believing in Ghosts or UFOs. They do it, but they cannot prove it because of some mysterious reason. With MAs its usually "secret" fights, or a "master" who wants to keep a low profile.....Lol.

I am ready to believe the Zapata claim, since he has a name. Why not post a link to prove it further?

[choylifutrocks]

Thai Bri, I take it you're an athiest

I can prove some Kung Fu styles will work, but you have to train hard like a Muay Thai guy

However, there is no way that you can ever make "Patta Cake" a dangerous MA. LOL. I agree with you there. I will however accept that it does make for great hand eye coordination.

[Thai Bri]

But hand eye co-ordination to do what? PLay patta cakke. It won't help you do anything else.

I agree with the view that some Kung Fu could be with effective training. Same for Karate and TKD too. But what form does this effective training take? Why, they train like a Thai Boxer! Thats what form it takes!

[krys]

Here is one of the links to emiliano zapata's (yaw yan champion) the official website is under reconstruction and you won't find everything there, anyway he was never defeated in 105 fights among them MT worldchampionships... this art looks like MT but is different (100% filipino): other strikes, ground fighting, weapon training.

http://www.users.netropolis.net/yawyan/zapatapro.htm

[Thai Bri]

The link didn't work for me.

[choylifutrocks]

But hand eye co-ordination to do what? PLay patta cakke. It won't help you do anything else.

I agree with the view that some Kung Fu could be with effective training. Same for Karate and TKD too. But what form does this effective training take? Why, they train like a Thai Boxer! Thats what form it takes!

Hand eye coordination is hand eye coordination. It can be used for anything that involves use of the hands and the eyes together. LOL. Wanking, writing, punching, etc.

I disagree TKD (in it's Americanized form, the only one I can vouch for) would not be effective even in a hard training environment. Anyone who tries a HUGE spinning kick to the head is gonna end up on his ass, unless they get EXTREMELY LUCKY Karate can be cool, but I don't like the punch--retract--punch--retract thing. Makes for a very slow offense.

An art will still be the same if practiced like like Muay Thai, it will just include harder conditioning and sparring-- a quality MANY MA schools lack that MT ha.

[Thai Bri]

Hand eye co-ordination is specific. For example, you need it to fly a plane. But learning how to thread a needle will not help you fly a plane.

And I know that some people can become effective fighters despite the arts they practice but, in your example, the only person needing the luck is the guy throwing the kick. Because, without the luck, it won't land.

[choylifutrocks]

Hand eye co-ordination is specific. For example, you need it to fly a plane. But learning how to thread a needle will not help you fly a plane.

And I know that some people can become effective fighters despite the arts they practice but, in your example, the only person needing the luck is the guy throwing the kick. Because, without the luck, it won't land.

Ok, you've got a point about threading. But, you can't deny that if a person who was once in Wing Chun became wise enough to enter a Boxing gym that he would not have better hand-eye coordination than some joe off of the street. The hand-eye coordination factor of Wing Chun that I presented was meant as more of a joke than an argument for a good quality. I basically meant that the most you'll get out of it is hand eye coordination.

I think you were confused about what I said regarding the TKD guy and the kick. I meant that if some TKD guy tried one of his big stupid kicks on me (for example), he would need lots of LUCK to make it count. He's most likely end up on his face b/c as soon as his back is exposed, he'd be tackled face-down, straight into the ground-- no thanks to my CLF training. I think we agree there, but I may have made my previous point poorly.

Personally, I think you're so bent on arguing all the time that you often selectively read things so that it seems like good material to argue against, even if it runs parallel with your ideas Just kiddin'.

I think MT is freggin' awesome, and would recommend anyone who wants to be able to defend themselves to take it or San Shou along with a good grappling art like BJJ or wrestling.

However, I believe many arts would be more effective if they trained at the intensity of MT / Boxing / Wrestling. I believe that is what makes MOST of the difference in a number of arts. Those arts that teach their studenst to "RELY" on big huge goofy spinning kicks, hopping around like they're standing on coals, and retarded jump kicks are gonna be a waste no matter what.

Lol, I was watching XMA (Xtreme Martial Arts) on the Discovery Channel and everyone at my GF's house was like WOW, when they saw some dude kicking 8 feet high repeatedly in a sparring match. I just wish I could have sparred the guy and tackled his dumb ass.

[Uchiha_Anbu]

Here is a quote from that XMA show on the discovery channel. "This seemingly uncoordinated flailing of arms and legs, is the ultimate expression of martial skill." I laughed long and hard when I heard that ignorant shiit. People who have'nt experienced boxing or any pysicial fighting have trouble understanding the dynamics of what is going on in a match. Flailing around and punching from useless angles(from a power perspective) is only good for sneaking points in on some tard.

[Thai Bri]

"Personally, I think you're so bent on arguing all the time that you often selectively read things so that it seems like good material to argue against, even if it runs parallel with your ideas Just kiddin'."

What a terrible accusation! Haw haw haw!

I think the WC guy in a boxing ring would be too busy realising that his WC isn't working to take advantage of his supposed hand to eye co-ordination.