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  • koto_ryu
    replied
    Originally posted by ZillaBilla
    Had a look at the Jim Lacy guy, its not really a video though, pics stuck together. The video I got is more impressive than that, though that might be my biased opinion. But basically the one I got is a competition to see who can break most in three minutes, though they are placed on a solid stand, this Lacy guy holds it in one hand and breaks with the other.

    You’re right about coconuts not hitting back, but it takes a lot of control over your body to generate that sort of strength, in my opinion if you can do that, you probably have a very strong nervous system, which in turn should give you the ability to apply such strikes with maximum efficiency.
    Peep this though: http://bullshido.net/forums/showthre...ghlight=ashida

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  • ZillaBilla
    replied
    Had a look at the Jim Lacy guy, its not really a video though, pics stuck together. The video I got is more impressive than that, though that might be my biased opinion. But basically the one I got is a competition to see who can break most in three minutes, though they are placed on a solid stand, this Lacy guy holds it in one hand and breaks with the other.

    You’re right about coconuts not hitting back, but it takes a lot of control over your body to generate that sort of strength, in my opinion if you can do that, you probably have a very strong nervous system, which in turn should give you the ability to apply such strikes with maximum efficiency.

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  • koto_ryu
    replied
    Originally posted by ZillaBilla
    I have a video of a coconut breaking competition between instructors in our Tai Chi school, they all use palm strikes for this, some of the strikes break the coconuts in half others make them burst at their sides in to several fragments. I would like to post it for ya'll to have a look, however its probably about 10 mb, and I don’t know how or where to upload it for a viewing, any suggestions welcome.
    There's videos of Jim Lacy doing it people can find if they choose. However........

    "Coconuts don't hit back"

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  • ZillaBilla
    replied
    I have a video of a coconut breaking competition between instructors in our Tai Chi school, they all use palm strikes for this, some of the strikes break the coconuts in half others make them burst at their sides in to several fragments. I would like to post it for ya'll to have a look, however its probably about 10 mb, and I don’t know how or where to upload it for a viewing, any suggestions welcome.

    Leave a comment:


  • chris davis 200
    replied
    Hi ppl,

    Palm strikes have a different sort of effect to fist strikes. they serve different purposes and result in different ends

    The idea is that a normal fist strikes will generally cause a more localised impact with little happening to the structure of the person unless levers are involved such as the chin.

    A palm strike on the other hand with make a deeper penetration into the structure but less surface damage. Hitting the back or side of the skill with a heavy. aligned palm strike will cause heavy stunning or knock out. Whereas striking the back or side of the head with a fist you will probably damage your hand. Not because the fist is less effective – just that it has a different purpose.

    Also when striking the face, a palm is very effective at covering the primary senses of the opponent. A good palm to the face will heavily and directly effect the eyes,nose and mouth in a single shot, while penetrating past the surface into the brain at the same time. This will seriously stun the opponent opening up a finishing shot or throw.

    A fist generally will have to target these areas over a number of blows, hitting the nose definitely effects the eyes, but not the mouth, and not in the same way. It will cause more surface trauma though.

    Now if we look at body shots.

    External style punches tend to impact the surface layers of muscle and fat tissue, unless directed at bone areas such as the ribs, The cause of this sort of strike is localized trauma to the impact area, whether that be a broken rib or soft tissue damage (which can be extremely debilitating!)

    Palm strikes generally work on a different principle, causing a heavy wave of shock to pass into the body, not causing localized trauma to the impact zone. This shock passes through the surface tissue into the organs and central nervous system. Often when hit with a good aligned internal palm strike the receiver will feel the effect in there spine and coccyx.

    These deeper penetrating strikes with the palm should be performed very differently than just punching with an open hand (which doesn’t really work too well!). Alignment, rotation, speed, penetration, tendon power, relaxation and timing are all key to the implementation of effective palm strikes.

    As an example I have been hit with full head protection by good puncher and had a moderate shock but still well able to fight on(the padding takes away the punches main effect, localized blunt trauma). I have been hit with a heavy palm strike in full protection and been stunned for 30 minutes.

    Are palm strikes effective? YES when performed in the right circumstances with the correct training in how to do them. Are they better than punches? NO the two have different effects.

    Cheers
    Chris

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  • 47MartialMan
    replied
    Palm strikes under the chin and on the jaw hinge works fine

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  • Tant01
    replied
    Originally posted by HtTKar
    Also palm strikes are easier if you actually already have a hold of the person. This way you can pull them towards you with one hand while hitting them under the jaw or nose with a palm stike. You can get a lot more power behind rabbit punches than regular punches. I dont think anyone would doubt that a palm strike to the back of the skull would knock people out.
    But to answer your question, I have never knocked someone out using this technique alone.

    Any time you intentionally target "critical" parts of a human, anatomically speaking, it becomes a tool of assassination not SD. The back of the skull is very close to "Atlas and Axis" Or C-1 and C-2. Separation of these Vertabrae will cause instant death. For that matter it is not unheard of for the DA to charge a pro boxer in a fight with ADW because his fists can be considered deadly weapons, eh? The back of the skull IS particularly vulnerable to concussion, severe trauma to the Medulla can result in coma and death. Go play nice.

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  • jules
    replied
    Yinboxer,
    Palm strikes are safer because there is a chance that you might hit the other guy in the head. Boxers had solid fists... If you hit the heavy bag for a long time it's like hitting wood.

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  • jules
    replied
    palm strikes do work and can knock people the f*ck out, all you have to do is look at the early pancrase fights with Bas Rutten. Now, IIRC; Bas said that you can do everything with a palm that you can do with a fist other than an uppercut.

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  • Tom Yum
    replied
    Originally posted by Yinboxer
    Just ask Mike Tyson how well a punch works when you aren't wearing gloves! I believe he broke his hand punching a guy in the face, and the other guy didn't even fall down! Punches do have their place, they are good for soft targets. Palm strikes are good for hard targets like the head.
    Hey yinboxer, Tyson's hand was broken but Mitch Green (i think) the dude he slugged had a badly broken jaw and a concussion from that hit. Punching is very deadly, even though it risks breaking your hand.

    Read Shamrock's book "Lion's Den."

    During his bouncer days, he punched an angry linebacker and put the guy in the hospital

    Leave a comment:


  • HtTKar
    replied
    Originally posted by Yinboxer
    To make a comparison with nature, what animal punches in a fight?
    A kangaroo punches with fists, and they're tough as hell. Imagine if Kung Fu started in Australia instead of China....

    Tansmanian Devil tornado backfist technique.
    Kangaroo fistacuffs.
    Crocodile spinning shredder

    Oh, the imagination.

    Leave a comment:


  • 47MartialMan
    replied
    Originally posted by Yinboxer
    Nothing like a crazed woman to help you work on your defense!
    Not really-cause you cant hit back as hard as you would like to.

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  • hornet
    replied
    Ba-Gua is based on the palm strike.

    Kung-fu is just a nick for chinese MA.

    That said the palm is not to me messed with.

    I use it more than anything else myself. Why? It's faster than a punch, more versatile and it needs no tension. (If you clench your fist you are spending up your precious energy)

    Yeah, you can break your wrist if you do dumb things with it.

    Leave a comment:


  • sdizier
    replied
    Originally posted by Yinboxer
    An open palm is also more "flexible" than a fist. Try it yourself. Make a fist, stretch your arm out and turn it as far as it will go. Now, open your hand and you will notice that you can turn it even further.

    To make a comparison with nature, what animal punches in a fight? A gorilla will slap you, a bear will swat you, a tiger will claw you (a "palm" with claws) and a monkey will slap and pinch you. I'm not saying you need to imitate the animals in your fighting style, It's just an observation.

    Just ask Mike Tyson how well a punch works when you aren't wearing gloves! I believe he broke his hand punching a guy in the face, and the other guy didn't even fall down! Punches do have their place, they are good for soft targets. Palm strikes are good for hard targets like the head.
    I almost agree with everything you say minus why mike can't punch without gloves. Boxers have "boxers fists" which occure when training with boxing gloves which prohibit you from training tight fists. A well trained MAist will never break their hands in combat since they train, usualy with out gloves, and with tight fists or open hand strikes .

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  • 47MartialMan
    replied
    Sticky hands-yeah, that only pisses them off more.

    Leave a comment:

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