Misconceptions of kung fu practitioners

[Tant01]

Spam...

You can attack the eyes, throat, temple, or groin, etc...

The clear lack of substance in your posts tells me you are here to promote WOW gold.

We have little tolerance for spam here.

~Tant01

[kingoftheforest]

I personally have found that KF teaches you to follow simple body mechanics.

Bruce Lee said it and I'm sure it was said before him, that you have 2 arms 2 legs a torso and a head.

You can only do certain things with the human body, you can also elicit certain reactions out of the body.

If you hit a guy in the belly, regardless of what technique or style you use he will lean forward.

Boxing uses a body blow for this, Karate a similar move, kickboxing can use a knee a kick or a punch.

It's been said before it's not the style it's the fighter.

My personal experience is that KF's main goal is to teach efficiency. positioning is VERY important IMHO in any martial art.

learning how to gain a better position than your opponent and keep that position is paramount to training.

learning what to do if you lose the better positioning is also important if not more so. I feel KF for my personal taste teaches this most effectively. Different strokes for different folks I guess.


Knowing your range which could also be considered position is important if you don't want to waste throwing punches and kicks when you can't even reach your opponent.

The eyes, throat and groin are valuable targets, because at any given time if your opponent can touch you, you can attack at least one of these, barring any major physical deformities on your part.

If a person is sitting on your chest their groin is exposed, even if biting it is your only option, depends on how bad you want to "win", whatever winning is in your mind. it differs from person to person I'm sure.

So it all comes down to learning the basic physics of the human body no matter what style of MA you use.

Taking out the weighted leg on an opponent while avoiding his attack will unbalance him, he'll either fall or he'll have to do something to regain balance if he can. Now you have disrupted his attack.

The KF styles that I have been taught, give you the mechanics to disrupt your attacker while at the same time doing damage to him. Multi tasking can be found in most effective MA weather KF or not.

it really all comes down to vehicle preference. You don't off road in you Z3 while at the same time you don't want to spend the gas money on a SUV for a marathon race.

[USArmyBJJ]

If a person is sitting on your chest their groin is exposed, even if biting it is your only option, depends on how bad you want to "win", whatever winning is in your mind. it differs from person to person I'm sure.

I agree with most of what you said, but I'm not sure I understand this. Unless the guy is literally tea-bagging you, how are you going to be able to bite him when he's sitting on your chest? Aren't your chest, shoulders and arms going to be in the way? I think I'm just confused as to how the attack would work in practice.

[kingoftheforest]

I agree with most of what you said, but I'm not sure I understand this. Unless the guy is literally tea-bagging you, how are you going to be able to bite him when he's sitting on your chest? Aren't your chest, shoulders and arms going to be in the way? I think I'm just confused as to how the attack would work in practice.

I was just using it as an example. If someone is sitting on your chest yours hands may be preoccupied with their attacks, in the struggle they may slide down leaving biting your only option for an offensive.

It's just one of a myriad of possibilities to a situation. I personally prefer to roll out of this situation and gain my feet.

But the other persons input may only allow for certain movements depending on their training or the landscape of the fight.

[USArmyBJJ]

I was just using it as an example. If someone is sitting on your chest yours hands may be preoccupied with their attacks, in the struggle they may slide down leaving biting your only option for an offensive.

Oh, I see. Makes sense.

It's just one of a myriad of possibilities to a situation. I personally prefer to roll out of this situation and gain my feet.

How would you perform the mount escape? I know the one you would use in BJJ, but I'm interested in how other arts teach the escape from here. Is it a bridge and roll kind of thing (similar to the basic BJJ escape)? Or something else entirely?

But the other persons input may only allow for certain movements depending on their training or the landscape of the fight.

Agreed.

[kingoftheforest]

How would you perform the mount escape? I know the one you would use in BJJ, but I'm interested in how other arts teach the escape from here. Is it a bridge and roll kind of thing (similar to the basic BJJ escape)? Or something else entirely?

Basically you shift weight to one side or the other and roll. This also depends on what KF styles you were taught and what the situation is during the fight.

There are some things you can do to make your opponent get off you too. I.E. biting the crotch or pulling them in and attacking the throat or eyes if available. Depends on the situation.

I will say I spend more time practicing not being in this position as opposed to getting out of it. Not to say i don't train to get out of being mounted, but there are plenty of ways to avoid it.

Coming down on top of your opponent, subduing your opponent before they have a chance to grapple you and such.

It takes less motor function to strike someone than it does to grab them, and I prefer the traditional Judo method of hitting then grabbing if I'm going that route.

Once you are mounted by someone you are now attempting to put a band aide on the situation because you lost the advantage somewhere. In practice you have the opportunity to go back and replay the scenario over and over to see where things went wrong and what you can do to fix the problem.

Somewhere along the line you lost the good positioning. So the real issue isn't how to get out of the mount (although this is valuable information that is a must need just in case) but in the precepts of most KF styles you would have messed up long before you get to this point.

[USArmyBJJ]

Basically you shift weight to one side or the other and roll. This also depends on what KF styles you were taught and what the situation is during the fight.

Do you bridge with your hips when you do this? Or do you literally just roll to your side? I'll be honest - if you're just rolling, it seems like it wouldn't really do anything to get the guy off of you. But I might be misunderstanding the technique. Do you have a video or picture or something of this? (looked on youtube, but didn't find anything) -- I think it would be pretty interesting to just compare and contrast diferent arts' response to particular situations.

There are some things you can do to make your opponent get off you too. I.E. biting the crotch or pulling them in and attacking the throat or eyes if available. Depends on the situation.

Wouldn't biting them on the crotch keep them attached to you?

I will say I spend more time practicing not being in this position as opposed to getting out of it. Not to say i don't train to get out of being mounted, but there are plenty of ways to avoid it.

Good idea. I don't think anyone in any art wants to be mounted! That is not a good position to be in.

It takes less motor function to strike someone than it does to grab them, and I prefer the traditional Judo method of hitting then grabbing if I'm going that route.

I prefer using strikes to move into grappling as well. BJ Penn had a really good section on that in his book.

Once you are mounted by someone you are now attempting to put a band aide on the situation because you lost the advantage somewhere. In practice you have the opportunity to go back and replay the scenario over and over to see where things went wrong and what you can do to fix the problem.

Agreed.

Somewhere along the line you lost the good positioning. So the real issue isn't how to get out of the mount (although this is valuable information that is a must need just in case) but in the precepts of most KF styles you would have messed up long before you get to this point.

Agreed. I think in the precepts of just about any martial art, you want to avoid being mounted. I wouldn't go so far as to say that if you're there it's because you "messed up," (sometimes, the other guy is just better than you, or just lucky, or whatever) but it is a terrible situation that you should know how to escape.

[kingoftheforest]

Do you bridge with your hips when you do this? Or do you literally just roll to your side? I'll be honest - if you're just rolling, it seems like it wouldn't really do anything to get the guy off of you. But I might be misunderstanding the technique. Do you have a video or picture or something of this? (looked on youtube, but didn't find anything) -- I think it would be pretty interesting to just compare and contrast diferent arts' response to particular situations.

You pretty much buck with your hips yes. It's basic body mechanics so there are only so many ways that it will work.

Wouldn't biting them on the crotch keep them attached to you?

Usually when something bites my crotch I shy away from it quick and try to make it stop. but that's just a general response it may not be 100% all the time. So you should follow it up quickly with something else.

[USArmyBJJ]

You pretty much buck with your hips yes. It's basic body mechanics so there are only so many ways that it will work.

Is it the same as this one: YouTube - Basic Mount Escape

Or is it done differently in Kung Fu?

Usually when something bites my crotch I shy away from it quick and try to make it stop. but that's just a general response it may not be 100% all the time. So you should follow it up quickly with something else.

I guess that depends on the strength of their jaw, right? I was thinking they'd bite and hang on.....then I don't know if you could jump up and get out. I've never been in the situation, but I would think that my response would be to punch harder and harder at their face....while screaming in pain at the thought of someone biting my crotch.

[Tant01]

Someone pointed out another route recently...

You pretty much buck with your hips yes. It's basic body mechanics so there are only so many ways that it will work.






Usually when something bites my crotch I shy away from it quick and try to make it stop. but that's just a general response it may not be 100% all the time. So you should follow it up quickly with something else.

Ever had someone up high on your chest (full mount)?

The hip sweep was suggested recently by a pro MMA guy on anotrher forum as a potential escape from the mount.

See the so called "electric chair (ala Eddy Bravo) SWEEP.

You can dislocate or hyper extend big joints too from the "inferrior" position...

Just a thought...

[USArmyBJJ]

Ever had someone up high on your chest (full mount)?

The hip sweep was suggested recently by a pro MMA guy on anotrher forum as a potential escape from the mount.

See the so called "electric chair (ala Eddy Bravo) SWEEP.

You can dislocate or hyper extend big joints too from the "inferrior" position...

Just a thought...

I could be wrong (and often am), but I believe that both the hip sweep and electric chair sweep are sweeps from the guard and half-guard respectively - not sweeps from under the mount.

If someone has high mount on you, I don't see the bridging escape that KOTF and I were talking about working. KOTF, what would be the escape in Kung Fu for someone sitting high on the chest? Presumably, you could grab them and pull them in for eye gouging etc (as you spoke of before), but considering that his knees would be under your shoulders, I'm not sure you'd have the leverage to do it.

[kingoftheforest]

I could be wrong (and often am), but I believe that both the hip sweep and electric chair sweep are sweeps from the guard and half-guard respectively - not sweeps from under the mount.

If someone has high mount on you, I don't see the bridging escape that KOTF and I were talking about working. KOTF, what would be the escape in Kung Fu for someone sitting high on the chest? Presumably, you could grab them and pull them in for eye gouging etc (as you spoke of before), but considering that his knees would be under your shoulders, I'm not sure you'd have the leverage to do it.

If his knees are over your shoulders then you'd still buck your hips but would use that movement to power your shoulder turning.

You generate all your power from your hips in KF but it translates throughout your entire body. So in essence you'd still buck and roll over you'd just concentrate the power from the move up into your shoulders.

Also if their knees are under your shoulders it puts you at an advantage of leverage because you can use your arms to trap out their punches and pull them over as well, thus achieving mount yourself or if they really mess up breaking their leg in the process.

Usually you can only get the leg break on beginners but the real fun is if you do it right they can't get their hands down and they smash the old noggin on the floor.

[jubaji]

If you hit a guy in the belly, regardless of what technique or style you use he will lean forward.

The eyes, throat and groin are valuable targets, because at any given time if your opponent can touch you, you can attack at least one of these, barring any major physical deformities on your part.

If a person is sitting on your chest their groin is exposed, even if biting it is your only option, depends on how bad you want to "win", whatever winning is in your mind. it differs from person to person I'm sure.

..........................

[USArmyBJJ]

Also if their knees are under your shoulders it puts you at an advantage of leverage because you can use your arms to trap out their punches and pull them over as well, thus achieving mount yourself or if they really mess up breaking their leg in the process.

Not sure I understand this move. Can you re-explain?

[kingoftheforest]

Not sure I understand this move. Can you re-explain?

Run this scenario in class with the above idea in mind. It'll be fun once you see it, just don't go to fast at first, speed it up as you understand more.

Your a smart boy you'll figure it out with a little trial and error.