TKD as a kicking art?

[Mr. Graves]

What you say is true of Olympic style TKD. We do not practice that. We do the traditional forms, but our sparring is more like what you see in the UFC.
We have all the bags that you would see in a boxing gym. We work alot on footwork and disguising our kicks either with foot work or kicking behind a combination of punches. The kicks are not only fast but they hurt. I have had several concusions even while wearing protective head wear and two broken ribs. ( The broken ribs where from a woman who does full contact fighting.) I have seen my instructor knock several people out while sparring.
So like I said before I don't know what kind of TKD studio others have been to but in the USTF and at Longview TKD WE HIT AND KICK HARD AND FAST
AND YOU DON'T SEE ANY OF IT COMING SO THAT YOU COULD GET OUT OF THE WAY. If you are every in the Longview Texas area drop by and say Hi.
We would love to have you.

[Tant01]

Welcome aboard!

So like I said before I don't know what kind of TKD studio others have been to but in the USTF and at Longview TKD WE HIT AND KICK HARD AND FAST AND YOU DON'T SEE ANY OF IT COMING SO THAT YOU COULD GET OUT OF THE WAY. If you are every in the Longview Texas area drop by and say Hi.
We would love to have you.

That sounded almost friendly!

"Hi"...

[Mr. Graves]

Yes it did, didn't it? It was meant to be. People see these specials on TV about TKD and usually it is the sports side of TKD which is fine for the olympics but it does not do justice to the true art of TKD.

[Tant01]

Yes it did, didn't it? It was meant to be. People see these specials on TV about TKD and usually it is the sports side of TKD which is fine for the olympics but it does not do justice to the true art of TKD.

Well, let me put it this way, (with a bit of creative editing and a personality like Mr.T or the Macho Man R. Savage) it comes off more like;

"I don't know what kind of TKD YOU DO but HERE in the USTF at LONGVIEW TKD WE HIT HARD AND KICK HARD AND SO FAST YOU DON'T EVEN SEE IT COMING!!! (YEAH) If you are ever in the Longview Texas area drop by and say Hi.
We would love to have you. (Can you say FRESH MEAT!? YEAH!)


I'm joking of course! Sorry about the hack job on your post! LOL Sounds hard core! Much more like the TKD (MDK) I've seen... Good stuff! Not the flippy pattycake bouncy-bounce crap you find in the Pee-Wee TKD Mc.Dojo's but the REAL TKD! I know what you're talking about but it's still sad that you have to distinguish yourself from "Olympic" style TKD

Again, nice to have you here and WELCOME aboard! Feel free to correct the misconceptions some have about the Korean arts.

[HtTKar]

http://www.ustfonline.com/camps

http://www.geocities.com/ustfhq/mcneely.html

USTF encourages cross-training, as do many other schools. Lets not confuse the school with the art.

[tkd_wrestler]

another thing people don't seem to realize is that the art of TKD, if you look at the forms, incorporate knees and elbows into it's arsenal. if TKD fighters learned to use these they get in the ring with the best of Muay Thai fighters.

i think TKD is a great kicking art if you learn to use your kicks right but you should make sure that the kicks you train to use are practical for the street.

another thing that people tend to criticize about TKD is that majority of the fighters don't keep their hands up. i've seen a couple of videos where people have gotten knocked out in the first few seconds of a match because they didn't have their hands up.

[GranFire]

You forgot to add in fancy.

*SNORT*

It's the least fancy MA around...rather ergonimic and economic...

[Maxx]

I started training in TKD in the early 70's and the perception of the art at that time was much different that it is today. Most of my instructors looked as though they had been through hell. Many of them had scars from fights and none of them looked like they came from the current "Jean Claud Van Damme Generation" as I like to refer to it as. They carried a sense of dread about them. Don't get me wrong. They weren't bad people, but you could tell from their presence that they knew what they were doing, they knew how to fight and they would probably kill if the situation called for it. In short, they struck me as warriors.

I don't see a lot of that today. Granted, on occasion I have come across a school or two where you will run across individual like that, but they are few and far between. That is the TKD that I remember.

I won't criticize the sport aspect of the art. I think that sport is good because it forces innovation. Coaches and instructors are always developing new methods of training and new techniques, combinations and concepts to beat the people who are at the top of the game today. Some of those people kick with snap... doesn't look powerful. I've seen people dropped by snappy kicks. Some people kick with raw power. I've seen some poeple walk through them. I think it all depends on what an individual is looking for.

Personally, I'm proud to practice an art which has reached so many niches and has effected the lives of so many people. Go any place in the world and you are likely to come across someone who has trained in TKD. With an art so wide spread the warriors will arise, the athletes will compete and Mom, Dad and little Jimmy can attend their 2 hours a week of classes and come away feeling that they are doing something good for themselves.

[Jon_B]

I've practiced Tae Kwon Do on and off for the last seven years. I can definitely say is great as a kicking art. I agree that many schools and many TKD black belts are lacking these days. I'm actually happy that I never made it to black belt. I know even at my best shape I still wasn't too great.

My kicks are pretty decent. Many of the black belts in the classes I take now have great form, but I have more power than a handful of them. The instructors, however, all have terrific kicks.

But hey... Reaching black belt just means you've gotten past the basics. My goal use to be to make it to 4th or 5th degree without teaching (If you don't teach at that skill level, 90% of your kicks are jump spinning and flying [The stage is commonly referred to as "The Jump Off"] ). Now that I've become interested in other arts, I'm not planning on going past 1st degree. As I've said before: Martial Arts like Karate, Kung Fu, and Tae Kwon Do are wonderful arts in any stage of one's Martial Arts journey.

[Jiu-fu fighter]

Yep, definetly, tae kwon do has been said to be about 70 percent kicking and 30 percent punching.

It builds crazy flexibility in the kicks , and teaches so many different types of kicks it is almost silly

however, I don't agree with a lot of the kicking being above the waist, the face is the most protected spot in a fight and hard to get to. also trying to kick that high is an invitation for the guy to throw you off balance.

take the flexiblity and kicks from tae kwon do, and than apply a more muay thai or kickboxing approach to them, basically, take out the guys foundation, the legs

peace

[GranFire]

Kicks above the belt are probably a safety measure. Miss on a low kick and you blow someones knee out!

Besides, it's better to have the posibilliyi to kick someone in the schnas and then change to something low than to be locked in on the thigh...

[mysteryninja]

true

I've been taking tkd for three years now, we do a lot of kicking. Usually the kicks are belt level. When sparring, kicking to the head is allowed.

[Piston]

I think the thing that is lacking in Tae Kwon Do the most is training solidly. What I mean by this is having decent, sturdy object to kick against. Some schools might be lucky enough to have a punch bag or two but most have to rely on focus pads and kick shields which are quite lacking I think. I got a body opponent bag just before christmas and its been fantastic adding that little bit of "reality" to what I'm doing. I never realised how powerful a sidekick is until I floored the 270lb thing with to quick, front leg waist high side kicks. Its also taught me about resistance i.e hitting something will generate an equal opposite force. For example one of my favourite shots middle turning kick followed by a high turning kick kept in a chamber becomes SO much harder when contending with rebound. TKD would gain a lot if training against a solid object became integral I think.

[gabbah]

Kicks above the belt are probably a safety measure. Miss on a low kick and you blow someones knee out!

Besides, it's better to have the posibilliyi to kick someone in the schnas and then change to something low than to be locked in on the thigh...

I've heard about blowing the knee out... do you huys think that is more probable in the TKD stance than in the muay thai stance or something?
I've been training kickboxing for 3 years, and taken countless muay thai lowkicks to the knee, and never had any problems. Many times I even "lazy block" the lowkicks, lifting my lead leg just as much need for the kick to land on my knee cap or side of the knee (where there's a hard bone). Sure, I my knee cap might be a bit sore afterwards when I take multipe hard lowkicks on it... but the same can happen if I block them on the same spot on my shin.

Perhaps the risk is much greater if you get a lowkick on the knee and you don't check it? Since the foot is resting on the ground it may buckle your leg if your stance is sideways enough. I don't see this happening with the muay thai stance though... The TKD is a lot more sideways, so maybe then?

Or maybe it has to do with if you wear shin guards or not?

[gabbah]

take the flexiblity and kicks from tae kwon do, and than apply a more muay thai or kickboxing approach to them, basically, take out the guys foundation, the legs

Is this possible though, since the kicks in TKD are not delivered from a typical "open stance" (muay thai/kickboxing ), but from a more "closed" sideways stance? So roundhouse kicks are harder to land with any power on the leg. So you have the sidekick left, which could be landed to the opponents knee I guess.
Trying to do a spinning roundhouse (not sure what it's called) and trying to hit the leg with your heel is quite difficult and more often than not leaves you out of balance I would say.
Well, I'm no TKD fighter, but I wouldn't dream of trying to land a round house to a guys leg from the sideways stance... I use sidekicks from that stance only (I suck at spinning techniques, so I stay away from them in sparring). I just don't see how you can get any power/weight behind the roundhouse kick from that stance.
In fact, when I sparr with a guy that fights in a TKD inspired way, it's an open invitation to counter punch when they use the round house, simple because
1. There is no real power in it
2. The leg is extended when it hits my side, so I can easily walk through the kick, as opposed to the typcal thai kick, where the leg is bend, and does not allow me to pass through.

What do you guys think?