The Tae Kwon Do Thread... Your thoughts.

[falcon3624]

I had an incident once where I was jumped by several attackers. Fortunately for me they tried to jump me in a parking lot and coming at me between the cars more than one of them could not jump on me at once. Training took over and I managed a few good strikes at noses, throats, and groins. When it was all said and done all of us went to the hospital. Several of them went with broken noses, lost teeth, and problems with throats and groins. It is possible to survive a situation in which you are jumped but it is important to remember that all rules go out the window and you have to be as dirty as possible if you are going to walk away from it.

People ask me if I would have not went for such vital shots if they think I would have walked away from it and I say hell no!!!! Although the fight was about even in the end if it would have not been for them jumping me in a parking lot where they could not all jump on me at the same time I would have been done for. Fact of the matter is that I sent a few of them to the hospital but I ended up there as well with a fractured skull from being struck with a lead pipe.

I don't really think there is anyone out there that can take 4 or more attackers in an open area.........closed quarters is another thing but in an open area at the same time........not possible in my opinion.

[Loor]

Here's another thing,

If you could read, you would have known that it was one person. And I would not have been aressted because I was jumped and have you ever heard of "self defense" its something where when people attack you, you respond with a counter-attack. Go back to school and learn something you asshole! And maby that thing with the 6" did occur, ever punched a dude in the nose before, yeah, thats one broken nose out of the three. One, I slammed into a goal post for soccer, and the other, I backfisted. I kicked one in the side of the head using an assisted jumping front snap and left a scar. His name was Jerod and he still hates me for it.

Are you kidding? Too easy? Have you been to my school? Are you ****ing Crazy?

And these KID, not kids, read moron, his name was Dalton, and he was a year older than I, when I slammed his head into the goal post, it gave him a cancussion and almost put him in a coma. Okay, a turning front twisting is very applicable. The only thing that twists is your leg, its like a roundhouse, only the opposite way. And did I land on my ass, no. And that was a different incident. Like I said, go back to school, maybe you did land on your ass, thats why your so stupid.

[RobertG]

Originally posted by falcon3624
I had an incident once where I was jumped by several attackers. Fortunately for me they tried to jump me in a parking lot and coming at me between the cars more than one of them could not jump on me at once. Training took over and I managed a few good strikes at noses, throats, and groins. When it was all said and done all of us went to the hospital. Several of them went with broken noses, lost teeth, and problems with throats and groins. It is possible to survive a situation in which you are jumped but it is important to remember that all rules go out the window and you have to be as dirty as possible if you are going to walk away from it.

People ask me if I would have not went for such vital shots if they think I would have walked away from it and I say hell no!!!! Although the fight was about even in the end if it would have not been for them jumping me in a parking lot where they could not all jump on me at the same time I would have been done for. Fact of the matter is that I sent a few of them to the hospital but I ended up there as well with a fractured skull from being struck with a lead pipe.

I don't really think there is anyone out there that can take 4 or more attackers in an open area.........closed quarters is another thing but in an open area at the same time........not possible in my opinion.

Falcon, you are also gigantic (240ish right?) and have trained for many, many years. And you still went to the hospital. Obviously I'm rather skeptical of the ability of a 14 year blue belt in TKD to do the same without winding up in the hospital either.

[RobertG]

*looking around for a mod* Loor I don't see you lasting too long around here with that kind of mouth.

What you described sounds like it'd get you nailed with an assualt charge in almost every state. Not to mention a suspension from school. Yes, I've heard of self-defense. There's a lot of threads about it around here. If you read them you'd know that you can get yourself in quite a lot of trouble EVEN if you are defending yourself, especially if you use excessive force. Smashing kids heads into goalposts sounds a bit excessive. Excuse me if I call BS when I smell a pile of it. I don't care what the kids names are or if they still hate you or what. You did not beat the crap out of 4 kids around the same age as you without sustaining injuries yourself. Not possible. Period. And if they went to the hospital I'm fairly certain the police would have been involved. The hospital generally does notify them if a bunch of kids come in with the crap beaten out of them. Sorry kid. I've trained a lot longer than you, I'm a lot older than you, I have a lot more life experience than you, and I'm pretty damn certain I'm a lot smarter than you. I know I don't come off that way, using my prodigious vocabularly like you.

I mean lets have a reality check here shall we? Read Falcon's post above. Same situation, 1 guy versus multiple opponents. He wound up in the hospital. He's 240 with a lot more martial arts experience than you. How do you figure that you, very unlikely to weigh more than 200, and with maybe a year of TKD (that's about blue belt I think), can send 4 guys to the hospital in one fight and not get touched? Doesn't happen.

Now stop going around using profanity and acting like a goddamn know-it-all brat. You kids are really tiresome.

[drocb]

I used to spend summers working out with a taekwondo troupe. when they sparred, they didn't use protective equipment, They did non-contact sparring!!!! yes it was crap, and I knew it was crap, but it was a nice workout

so these goons, didn't know what it was like to hit someone, and surely didn't know what it was like to take a hit... that is garbage.

[falcon3624]

Originally posted by RobertG



Falcon, you are also gigantic (240ish right?) and have trained for many, many years. And you still went to the hospital. Obviously I'm rather skeptical of the ability of a 14 year blue belt in TKD to do the same without winding up in the hospital either.

I don't consider myself gigantic.......lol.......I am 6'2" 240lbs. and I am 25 yrs. old. I started my martial arts training when I was 5 and been doing it ever since. I did get jumped more than once by 2 guys. The first time I wouldn't really call it jumped though, one guy thought I was someone else and came up to hit me and I laid him out. The other guy saw what was going on and came to help the first guy (already out of commision) and he got his too. I also ended up at the doctor that time with a broken hand. The second time both the guys were in a car and they were talking like they were going to beat me down. The guy in the driver side slammed the door into my knee and it got slammed right back in his face (knocked him out cold). By the time the other guy made it out and we sqared off it was one on one. This time I also ended up in the doctors office with a horribly bruised knee that I could only limp on.

I have never been truly jumped by several attackers out in the open at one time, but if I was in that situation I would run. I don't beleive there are too many people out there that would have faith in their ability in that situation, and those who do often loose that faith soon after coming into that situation. Fact of the matter is that no matter the training and the ability 4 on 1 is just not fair. I mean if 4 people jump on you simultaneously you would have to be able to jump up throwing both punches and both kicks at the same time and I highly doubt that is going to happen.

As far as a TKD practitioner taking out more than one person at a time, I seriously doubt that because TKD is not what I consider a combat art and to take on multiple attackers you would need something of that caliber. I have seen several times where TKD black belts that are suppose to be very good tournament fighters come into our BJJ class and get their ass handed to them by a guy that has been there about a month. I myself had the pleasure of getting to roll with a guy that was the Louisiana TKD state champion 3 times and I think he was the national champ one time. The guy told me that his striking abilities were too good and he would stop me on the way in, and I just kept my mouth shut and told him to show me. The first fight he cocked back for that big bad roundhouse and I rushed him with a single leg takedown........once we hit the ground it was over in a matter of seconds by means of a shoulder lock. Obviously he was not pleased and wanted to try again. This time he tried to punch me and I simply ducked under and took him down. Once again over in a matter of seconds via guillotine choke. Now if I can literally man handle a guy that is that good in TKD and a pretty big guy on his own (6'3" and 230lbs.) how am I to beleive that a guy that has 1 year experience in TKD and is probably 140lbs. is going to stop me and 3 other buddies without getting even a scratch?

[BadgerFu57]

I am a 15 year old who's been doing MA for a few months (I wrestled in junior high and wanted a new challenge). I take TKD, Hapkido, and BJJ.

TKD sparring is NOT fighting Loor. In TKD sparring, you can't punch to the face. You can't tackle. There is no grappling at all.

Your in Middle School. Fighting is probably somewhat different. Most middle school kids are not fighting for their lives. They won't be expecting you to be a lunatick and smash their heads into soccer goals. That's a huge lack of self-control.

I am 6'0" 200 lbs. If I got in a fight at school, someone would get hurt. My opponent and I would get suspended. My TKD/Hapkido instructor wouldn't let me keep taking classes most likely. (BJJ guys are a little different, lol, gotta love the Brazilian spirit!). In all honesty, school is not self-defense. You have parents and teachers. Unless a kid pulls a knife or gun, your probably not threatened too bad. Most likely, if you would let your EGO down, you could talk yourself out of it.

And finally.... the reason TKD is not popular here is because if you have ever seen a good fight, TKD guys never win. Go rent some No-Holds-Barred (NHB) videos. They are real fighting, no choreography. I recommend UFC 1-5 because I love Royce Gracie. He doesn't run his mouth like you either.

I take TKD for balance, flexibility, because it's only 10 bucks more a month with Hapkido, and some of the roundkicks and sidekicks are salvageable so long as they are below waste level. Personally though, I would just stick to snap-kicks. Nothing like a quick shot to the groin. I am a white belt (in TKD). If I was willing to pay the testing fee I could easily get my blue. I have been taking TKD for 2 months. It's not hard. Most of it is memorizing forms.

As for sparring. TKD people often have bad footwork because they aren't expecting to get tackled. Sure jumping is ok in sparring, but on the street any idiot who has played football will slam you down. I have "slipped" TKD axe kicks by black belts in sparring. I don't know if they teach you bob-and-weave and slip in TKD, but it's not that hard to slip a lot of kicks or just move out of range.

Your 14 though. Your not fighting experienced fighters. Your fighter middle-school kids who understand the word restraint. My fight techniques are: snap kick to the groin, eye-jab, or a Jiu-jitsu submission. Either way, someone is getting hurt. You can't get away with that in school. If I fight, I am ending it quickly and efficiently. So my only option, is not to fight.

[RobertG]

*applauds Badger* There is hope--at least one intelligent teenager in the world.

[Lizard]

I got attacked by multiple opponents once. I must have been about 10 -12. It was either three or four. Hit one of them once with a very badly thrown punch (at that time I had never done a striking art), then I missed with an attempted snap kick (during this entire time I was being punched by at least one other person). Then I think someone kneed me in the head then a teacher came and broke it up.

Oh and another time in high school I got attacked by four guys who were a year younger than me. I grabbed one of them in a sort of sleeper hold then a weak side kick towards the rest of them (so that they would back off while I delt with the guy I was holding), they ran away. They guy I was holding tried to run away but I started to knee him in the face. Them MY friends came and broke it up (they didn't want me to hurt him too badly). Bastards. I was also trying to rip his ear off. LOL

[eXcessiveForce]

Badger, Find a new school.


In my school, where I have taught TKD for over 10 years. We have done grappling, no pad sparring. Weapon sparring to grappling. We do punch to the head although anybody that punches to the head deserves what they get.

I've done TKD, BJJ, Muay Thai. Sounds like i'm the only one in the entire thread that had trained in each. The combine very well. And are combined in the system of TKD I learned.

I have always loved sparring with people from other styles and have been doing it for years. That is how you become a better martial artist.


IF the kick produces a knockout it doesn't matter how hard it was or whether it was "TKD" or "MT" because the foot stomp is universal.

If you think that all TKD people are unable to take on MT people you are delusional.

If you think someone is going to block a 5 move combination you are delusional.

If you think you are going to block several times in a street fight and then destroy your opponent you are delusional.

The more I hit the less i need to block
The more I block the more I get hit.
Thats how it works.

[falcon3624]

If you have taken BJJ and TKD what do you think about the usefulness of TKD kicks against a grappler? I think that since most TKD focuses mainly on kicking it is not adequetly suited to beat BJJ. The problem I find with striking against a good grappler is that most of the strikes get smothered when they shoot in. I usually do this against TKD guys. Soon as I see the leg cocking back or the punch coming I shoot to the inside and go for a takedwon. You say there is grappling in your TKD class and I have never heard of this. I was just wondering what art the grappling techniques came from.

[Tom Yum]

A highly skilled boxer who has seen MMA will take a slightly deeper stance if he knows he's fighting an MMA type fighter.

If he's a notoriously quick fighter with good reflexes, he will side step alot, pivot and then work different angles to screw up your rhythm and placement, work 1-3 punch combos and move before you can re asses. He's not going to fire punches standing still, he will play with your rhythm and timing, while being aware that if he plants too long or throws too many shots, he will eventually be playing your game.

If he's a brawler type boxer, he may not move around alot but he will feint to get you to enter for a takedown, sprawl and throw a flurry of hooks and uppercuts from the 'seperation'.

If a TKD fighter can play these kinds of games, they could potentially do well against a grappler, but most US TKD fighters don't train or prepare to fight against different fighting styles. If they did, TKD could become alot more effective.

Manson Gibson fights TKD style kicking against thai boxers in Thailand and has had success - he throws spinning back kicks, axe kicks, spinning back fists etc. The reason why he is successful is because he understands muay thai and conditions himself as hard as the Thais do. He's probably one of the few non-Koreans to put TKD style kicking and serious training to the test.

I think that shows that TKD has potential as a fighting style, but its unwillingness to train against other styles and its watered down popularity result in point fighting as its main goal.

[BadgerFu57]

Some Korean TKD guys are downright scary. In Martial Art magazine, there is a 68 year old TKD Master that runs 10 miles a day at 6 minute miles, kicks for an hour, stretches for an hour, then teaches all day. For 68 years old, not bad.

Now for the Geriatric match of the century, 68 year old Korean Man vs. 90 year old Helio Gracie. LOL, j/k.

[falcon3624]

Tom, I happen to have a buddy that fights in the NHB that's a boxer. He does alright considering he is more a brawler than technical. The only place he has had a real problem is that most boxers when in a bad situation will cover up to prevent from taking alot of hits. I saw a bad example of this week before last when he fought George Lockhart who is a seasoned grappler. Lockhart kept trying for that takedown and finally got it. This fight was for the FFC and the way they work it is if you get mounted and cover up without trying to improve your position they consider that as good as tapping out. This exact thing happened to him and he was pissed being that he had not taken one direct hit cuz he was covered up. How the fight would have ended if they would not have called it....who knows.

[BadgerFu57]

Why won't TKD incorporate more effective techniques and evolve? It could learn a lot from western boxing and Muay Thai.

Is the goal to be an olympic sport and make Korea look good, or to be able to whoop?