Arm bar while on back

[Bjjexpertise@be]

I have seen many people do the armbar while they are on their back, i have tried it many times but it never seems to work, any suggestions, hypothesises, comments?

[MrPoopy]

I don't like doing this while I have someone on their knees and I'm on their back. But if I'm on my back and I have them against my stomach, it's very easy to get. Hook the arm, push away on their face, put the leg over the head. Real easy.

[Bjjexpertise@be]

sorry, i wasn't clear enough. What i meant was to operate the armbar while you are on your back and your opponent is standing up.

[Bjjexpertise@be]

oh yeah, while we're at it, i got a question on the heel hook, After everything is set up, what i mean by set up is that i hooked his knee and hands locked around his ankle, what do i do? Do i lean back, pull back, or what? Help please

[DRLashambe]

Bjj:

Chances are, the problem you're having with the arm-bar is that you're not "shrimping" out to one side enough. By the time you are putting your calf in front of your opponent's face, you should be almost on your side. After this, the other two things to look out for is that you are: first, holding your opponent's arm in such a way that if he were to stick his thumb out, it would be pointing to the ceiling; second, you must be squeezing his arm between the lower part of your thighs, just above your knee.
As far as the heel hook, you need to hold the top of your opponent's foot in your armpit, while holding his leg with both of your legs. His leg should not be able to move! Now, you use the bottom of your forearm to push your opponent's heel AWAY from you. This creates the pressure on the tendons that causes someon to tap out. If you e-mail me, I can send you a picture of what this is supposed to look like.

[Kilo5518]

Just some comments:

I really like the heel hook. The key as said above is getting the top of the oponents foot (the toes and just above the toes) trapped in your armpit. The heel should be sticking out at that point. Then wrap the inside of your forearm around around the outside of the heel and at the base (foot end) of the achilles tend. Your hands should then clasp in a tradition no thumbs hold. Keep everything tight while holding your opponents leg in place with your locked knees.

At this point it would help to lean back a bit and pull the entire hold close to your body while pulling his heel across your body, up and toward your head-keeping everything to your body the whole time. I wouldn't suggest falling back with your training partner if you have him locked down good. You will most likely tear tendons in his ankle as well as his knee. The differance between a good heel hook and a great heel hook can be felt in the knee of your opponent. If done correctly their is equal pain to both areas.

As for the armbar- I am not sure which one you are talking about and from what position. Is it a reinforced armbar from your guard?

[Bjjexpertise@be]

If you e-mail me, I can send you a picture of what this is supposed to look like.

That would be nice, my email is ngmatt@bellsouth.net


As for the heel hook, i'm still mystified, once i hok his left leg with my right, does his toes pointo to my left or to my right? do i apply pressure the same way i apply pressure to an armbar?

[DRLashambe]

Hopefully the picture I've sent you clears some things up. Are you able to work with someone who knows the heel hook? The best way to learn it is to have someone do it to you first, and then you can feel where the pressures should be.

[Bjjexpertise@be]

The picture you have sent me showed me how to complete the lock, the thing is though, I still don't know how to apply the pressure. And no i don't know someone who knows how to do it. The people that i know thing it's too dangerous of a lock to perform.

P.S. The guy in the picture performed the heel hook differently than Rigan Machado, what gives?

[Kilo5518]

If you are hooking his left ankle you would trap his lleft leg with your right leg (leg over) and point his toes to your left (into your body and pit). You can then either fall back locking eveything tight with your knees or secure him with your feet and hook him from standing. Some guys secure the leg by locking in tight with the knees. When I lay back I can using do it by simply draping my right leg across his waist.

[Bjjexpertise@be]

Now the question is, how do i apply pressure? sorry if i'm getting you guys frusturated

[DRLashambe]

Again, once you have your opponent's foot trapped, you use your forearm to force his ankle away from your body. As long as you are keeping the top part of his foot from moving, forcing his ankle away from you creates incredible pressure. As for your friends who think it's a dangerous manuever: it is often disallowed in amateur competitions because putting it on fast and hard can cause a major injury. Get a friend to allow you to put him in this hold, with the understanding that you will put the pressure on slowly, and let go as soon as he says that he is in pain.

[Kilo5518]

We do hooks all of the time in class during randori. They really are not that dangerous if both you and your opponent know what you are doing. With experience you know when you are locked down and that it is time to tap. You don't need to wait until your ankle is bent. If the guy is positioned right, their isn't much need to wait for a ton of pressure to be applied, the results are inevitable in training. You would risk it a little more in a tourney or on the street but not in training with your partners. We don't have any ego when it comes to tapping. You can't train if you are hurt. As for applying it, there really is no ever increasing pressure with a heel hook. Pressure is applied and then the ankle stops. If you continue, it will tear stuff. On your buddy, lock him in, apply pressure until the ankle stops, then wait for him to tap. If he doesn't give him a couple light pushes and he will submit. If he is stupid and doesn't tap, just go for something else. Its not worth it.

[Bjjexpertise@be]

So there is no ever increasing pressure like in an armbar? So once u get into position then the pressure is automatically applied?

[DRLashambe]

Sorry, I disagree with kilo. I'm almost always the "tackling dummy" for in class demonstrations (because I'm larger than everyone else; my trainer wants things to look dramatic), and I can definately feel increasing pressure. The farther away you push your opponent's ankle, the more pressure their is. What kilo might be describing is the fact that it takes VERY LITTLE pressure to make a major difference with this lock.