Considering switching to Muay Thai

[M@T]

Originally posted by Great Sage
I tend to agree with MuayThai Fighter... Spin kicks are 99% useless.

Which is the main reason why I've switched to Muay Thai. I've been doing the kickboxing for a few years now and its all Jump spinning this and double super turbo inverted whirlwind kick that and i'm not into that stuff.

I can hit a focus pad with a fair amount of power using a spinning hook kick but in a fight I reckon it'd be useless. Why bother spinning then hitting when you can just hit straight off. The only time I throw a spinning hook is when I throw a roundhouse with my left leg and they jump to my left, then i'll sometimes throw a spinning hook with my right but as someone said, its easily telegraphed and even if it does hit it doesn't have the power to do real damage. Unless you have serious leg power after like 10 years of training.

[NuffSpeed]

yes, there is spin kicks in traditional muay thai. Good luck pulling a clean one off in a fight though.

[MuayThaiFighter]

There is no point in spin kicks,is it not a contradiction to martial arts?,after all in martial arts we learn that speed bread powers,if that is the case why learn the spin kicks,it takes longer time to execute one then to just do a regular kick therefore you end up with less power.

Think about it,it's only common sense that it will take a longer time to twist your whole body and spin around at 360 degrees then to just kick.

[Damian Mavis]

The only reason I use spin kicks in the ring is because I go against fighters like you MTF. By that I mean they completely discount the kick, so don't train it, in fact they don't even train defending from it (very common in Thailand) So when I use it, it is a surprise and comes from an angle of attack they are not used to. It works for me because it is a surprise. If I went against an opponent that trains them, which I have, then I do not use them. But lucky for me most Muay Thai guys don't bother! In thailand very few of them train the tradtional spinning wheel kick and they certainaly don't train any of the other spin kicks from other arts, again this is lucky for me.

You are right though, they do take longer but should have more power. The advantage to them like I said earlier is that they make a good surprise technique that can land since a defense for it is rarely trained.

I don't know man, I don't know what to tell you.... I spar against guys that defend from all my straight up kicks like teep and round kick really well but if I throw an occasional spin kick they eat it and are always caught by surprise. KEY WORD is occasional, if I use them to much they start to recognise them and defend from them, but guess what that means.... it means they are actively learning to defend from them by me throwing them at them too much. Sparring with friends is the only time this is a problem, in the ring against a strange opponent who doesn't know me from squat won't have had that experience.

Damian Mavis
Honour TKD

[MuayThaiFighter]

Originally posted by Damian Mavis
The only reason I use spin kicks in the ring is because I go against fighters like you MTF. By that I mean they completely discount the kick, so don't train it, in fact they don't even train defending from it (very common in Thailand) So when I use it, it is a surprise and comes from an angle of attack they are not used to. It works for me because it is a surprise. If I went against an opponent that trains them, which I have, then I do not use them. But lucky for me most Muay Thai guys don't bother! In thailand very few of them train the tradtional spinning wheel kick and they certainaly don't train any of the other spin kicks from other arts, again this is lucky for me.

You are right though, they do take longer but should have more power. The advantage to them like I said earlier is that they make a good surprise technique that can land since a defense for it is rarely trained.

I don't know man, I don't know what to tell you.... I spar against guys that defend from all my straight up kicks like teep and round kick really well but if I throw an occasional spin kick they eat it and are always caught by surprise. KEY WORD is occasional, if I use them to much they start to recognise them and defend from them, but guess what that means.... it means they are actively learning to defend from them by me throwing them at them too much. Sparring with friends is the only time this is a problem, in the ring against a strange opponent who doesn't know me from squat won't have had that experience.

Damian Mavis
Honour TKD

You seem to think spin kicks will work against a person who has never trained in them or even trained to avoid being hit by them,funny how despite never learning them or to defend against them TKD guys who have tried to use them on me have always failed because I could see it coming.

I am not trying to say you don't know what you are talking about we just have different views on these spin kicks,perhaps they have worked for you,where as I have never used them and have never been hit by one.

Martial arts is supposed to always teach you to be prepared at all times and expect everything,so a spin kick has never worked on me and I can't imagine it ever will.

Against someone who is a extremely good and quick fighter with both hands and feet it would be impossible to have enough time to jump and kick person,you better be pretty damn fast in blocking.Most Muay Thai fighters kick quickly and hard so it would be hard to use a jump kick.

I learnt a few jump kicks,like spinning back kick and spinning hook kick and spinning cresent kick when I was in karate and I found sure they were fun to do in class but they never really worked in tournaments.I personally would never use them in sparring or in a real fight.

[Matteo79]

Knees and Elbows

In the US every state has rules that govern combat sports for both amateur and pro contest. For instance.... Some states like Iowa allow full contact fighting (knees & elbows to the head and anywhere else for that matter, and no pads) in amateur fights. But in Texas any amateur competition knees and elbows to the head are illegal and you must wear head, foot, and shin pads. Even in states that allow full contact amateur fights, the sanctioning body determines the rules for the tournaments. Usually at the big amateur tourneys (i.e. Divisional & Nationals) if knees and elbows are all allowed it is usually not to the head and you must wear knee and elbow pads. Basically if you want to fight a real MT fight in the US you gotta step up to the pro level and go to someplace like New Jersey or Iowa. Even though it is allowed the state of Texas won't issue permits for professional full contact fights.

[M@T]

Been at it a few months now and its the best move I ever made. Totally more enjoyable and usable than kickboxing. None of that jump spinning super duper mega inverted hook kick rubish

I'd certainly recommend any other kickboxers considering MT to make the switch

[Tom Yum]

Originally posted by MuayThaiFighter


You seem to think spin kicks will work against a person who has never trained in them or even trained to avoid being hit by them,funny how despite never learning them or to defend against them TKD guys who have tried to use them on me have always failed because I could see it coming.


I personally would never use them in sparring or in a real fight.

I think Damian emphasized that he used them sparringly. He didn't say they were the bread and butter of his arsenal.

BTW, Damian's win in Thailand was a 1st or 2nd round KO by spinning back kick to the body against a local. Check out Manson Gibson, whom also fought pro in Thailand. This guy used a lot of spinning wheel kicks and spinning backfists, which caught some of the Thais by suprise and gave him the momentum to win.

You probably sparred against point TKD fighters who tried to use spin kicks as starting moves. Of course you can get inside or get a leg against someone trying a lot of fancy high kicks. There are a lot of mediocre TKD fighters who could regularly get beaten by mediocre Thai boxers, just bc of the difference in repertoir and intensity.

I wouldn't discount all TKD fighters. There's a guy who I went to school with (V.S. Nguyen), who was the US Jr lightweight and Jr middleweight? champ, who kicks obscenely hard and fast. He could probably handle himself well against a medicore MT fighter.