Muay Thai needs to evole

[wildchild]

I love Muay Thai, however i feel it needs to evolve or bring back older techniques for ring fighting and UFC style fighting. I personally feel that sweeps and trips could be used in clinching range. Jermaine Andre seems to have adapted Muay Thai really effectively and i think his style could pave the way for the evolution of Muay Thai. What do you people think?

[wael k]

wildchild listen ur right in one way but muaythai against any style is affective at the top ,cause they use simple but well trained moves so it's technically for me unbeatable except for a very professional and experts martial artists ,so what i think muay thai is pretty good this way very effective and indeed very lethal.

And anyway how long have u been doin muaythai?

[M@T]

You dont need to muay thai to evolve, you can evolve yourself mate

[Zero18]

Personally I feel that you should try some matches that use the orient rules and you will not have to question the techniques. that's simply my opinion

[chalambok]

When muay Thai used to be fought in a pit and rounds were timed for how long it would take a cracked coconut to sink in a bucket of water or until 1 fighter could not continue, everything, and I do mean everything was legal: throws, sweeps, eye gouges, biting, joint manipulations and locks. But with the adoption of the elevated ring, the spectators in the Golden Circle (read ringside) could not always see what was happening when the fighters would go to the ground. So gradually much of the ground-fighting disappeared from the larger stadiums; but if you are diligent you will find it still happening up-country and sometimes in cross-border Temple fights. There are many instructors who teach the full spectrum of Thai National Martial Arts, but like any program, there is a synergy to the methodology, and few non-Thai care to train that hard for 4-6 years and so they do not get the 'system' but merely the basic stand-up kickboxing phase; which, not incidentally, is usually all the average person will need.

[wildchild]

Im not saying that the techniques arent effective, i know they are, but i feel that Muay Thai in this country is a bit 1 dimensional, its sometimes looks more like kickboxing. Fighters should learn Muay Boran and the traditional side of Muay Thai so we dont water the martial side of things down.

[S.Anucha]

dude

Dude you a getting taugh tthe wrong shit mate, you sur eyou aint going to kickboxing classes?

Muay Thai is Thai Boxing, most of all the Muay Thai masters know Muay Chao Chur (Muay Boran) it is a martial art man, Muay Thai is a traditional martial art.... Muay Chao Chur is what you get taught from a good teacher but he aint gonna teach you al the technqies until he see's you are ready to learn them.

You must learn the traditional side, you must ask your teacher to teach you it, show him that you're interested in that side of the tradition. Do you perform the Wai Kru ceremony? if not learn it as that is an important part of muay Thai, learn why the drummer in the 3 (sometimes 4 peice) band plays with his elbows kness and head! Theres a lot to muay thai that many of the parctitioners dont know about simply because they are not getting taught it from the right teachers or they simply dont worry for the traditional side of it.

this is what i get taught and this what each and every Muay Thai practitioner should be getting taught if he has a good teacher.

Its one thing a Kickboxer teaching the basics of Muay Thai and wearing Thai uniform and thus labeling his classes as "Muay Thai" but quite another when you recieve authentic tuition from a good Muay Thai teacher, you will know when you get the right teacher, if you are deadly serious then save up and leave to Thailand, remeber its the way of life and the heart of a Muay Thai fighter that makes it what it is, you must live Muay Thai to understand it.

http://www.muaythai.com/En/indexkon/mainkon.html

[JimmyRice]

Wildchild, I think I can see the gap your talking about in this forum. Muay Tai is indeed not suitable alone for most fighters in UFC style fighting. But, those fighters know more than one style most of the time. A fighter can learn Muay Tai AND Jujutsu for the grappling end of their style. But, that would NOT be a new style of Muay Tai. That would simply be a person that is refined in more than one art. I feel that their are almost NO modifications needed for any of the martial arts out there. Just about what ever you are wanting to achieve; there is an art or several seperate arts that you could mix yourself for your own personal use to suit your needs. I think tradition holds its roots so that we have the option of expanding into our own compound styles (Bruce Lee's Jeet Kune Do for example). But, it would be wrong to CHANGE Muay Tai (not that I think you are implying that) if you feel Muay Tai is obsolite and you are really serious about branching your own Neo-style you better work hard, because there wil be a lot of people waiting to appose you.

[S.Anucha]

Guys, Muay Thai is a martial art that goes back to days when Siamese were fighting invaders off with sticks, picks and their hands. There is grappling in Muay Thai, ground grappling. What I think is happening is that most of us here are not being taught these techniques because either your teacher doesnt know them or some of you havnt reached that level yet.

[JimmyRice]

If a Muay Tai practitioner were not being taught "Muay Tai grappling moves" by their teacher/instructor or their teacher simply didnt know them to teach them to begin with than what would be wrong with that person turning to another martial art style for grappling techniques? There are a lot of martial arts out there, and a lot of styles/techniques etc. have been lost or are fading over time due to lack of mainstream exposure, or maybe the techniques are kept from the public, I dont know, but what ever the reason, if people dont know the techniques and dont have training oppertunities to learn them in their area than I feel it would be okay for someone to turn to another style/school for help in an area that they are not currently receiveing training for in at their current school (personaly I find it hard to learn grappling/ARC technique through books alone)...I am probably getting off the subject of this forum now...so Ill shut up

Anyways, I think this forum subject may have been controversial for some people but has brought up some very good points and has been very enlighting

[S.Anucha]

jujitsu ?

[Nitro]

Or do you mean "Muay Thai needs to devolve"?

Some interesting opinions thrown out on this thread.

Contrary to popular belief, Muay Thai is NOT a combat art. Muay Thai is a ring sport which developed from the earlier combat art. It's a distinction worth noting. Pahuyuth (lit. "arm combat")/ Muay Boran (lit. "ancient boxing") have some very effective holds, takedowns, etc. The problem with many of the old techniques is that they're too dangerous for the ring. The technique called "tai nah ("plowing the field"), where a fighter grabs an opponents roundhouse and pushes the opponent backwards, is no longer allowed after a fighter fell out of the ring and hit his head on the concrete floor.

There is still an annual "Kaht Cheuak" (wraps worn in place of gloves) competition between Thai and Burmese boxers. The Burmese are trained to use head butts, shoulders, and are not averse to biting. Despite this, the Thais always dominate the competition because the weapons they use are perfected to such a high level. Kaht Cheuak makes for great entertainment, but it's not something that you want to see every day; win or lose, the fighters take too much punishment.

For self-defense, definitely, the old techniques should be learned and kept alive; but the sport is better off keeping them out of the ring. That being said, it ain't Muay Thai if you ain't using the elbows!

Bowie Sor Udomsorn put his elbows to good use and won a unanimous decision against Klairung S. Sasipha Gym:

[S.Anucha]

Re: dude

Originally posted by S.Anucha
Dude you a getting taugh tthe wrong shit mate, you sur eyou aint going to kickboxing classes?

Muay Thai is Thai Boxing, most of all the Muay Thai masters know Muay Chao Chur (Muay Boran) it is a martial art man, Muay Thai is a traditional martial art.... Muay Chao Chur is what you get taught from a good teacher but he aint gonna teach you al the technqies until he see's you are ready to learn them.

You must learn the traditional side, you must ask your teacher to teach you it, show him that you're interested in that side of the tradition. Do you perform the Wai Kru ceremony? if not learn it as that is an important part of muay Thai, learn why the drummer in the 3 (sometimes 4 peice) band plays with his elbows kness and head! Theres a lot to muay thai that many of the parctitioners dont know about simply because they are not getting taught it from the right teachers or they simply dont worry for the traditional side of it.

this is what i get taught and this what each and every Muay Thai practitioner should be getting taught if he has a good teacher.

Its one thing a Kickboxer teaching the basics of Muay Thai and wearing Thai uniform and thus labeling his classes as "Muay Thai" but quite another when you recieve authentic tuition from a good Muay Thai teacher, you will know when you get the right teacher, if you are deadly serious then save up and leave to Thailand, remeber its the way of life and the heart of a Muay Thai fighter that makes it what it is, you must live Muay Thai to understand it.


http://www.muaythai.com/En/indexkon/mainkon.html

[Nitro]

S. Anucha,

You already posted that one. What point are you trying to emphasize?

Please explain why the drummer in the band plays with his elbows, knees, and head. I've seen hundreds of fights, but have never seen anyone use his head to play the drum. Sounds like something put on for tourists at the Rose Garden.

I agree with you that tradition is important, but don't follow it blindly. Knowing a few esoteric facts isn't going to win you fights.

[doubleouch]

Muay thai is a ring sport!! In thailand they don't call it marital art no more than we call boxing martial art here. Maybie it wasn't that way once upon a time, but that is the way it is now. Now if you are trying to make a self defense system out of muay thai then of course you have to adapt and change it to meet those needs!