"combatives"

[Tant01]

Some years ago a good friend of mine said that so called "combatives" would be the next big FAD in the MA industry.

Today I noticed "Gracie Combatives" is a registered trademark...

Imagine THAT?

"... Although Gracie Jiu-Jitsu consists of over 600 techniques, studies of the fights conducted by members of the Gracie Family have shown that 36 techniques have been used more often and with greater success than all the other techniques combined. Soon after these studies were conducted the Gracies realized that the fastest way to effectively prepare any new student to defend themselves against a larger, untrained opponent was to focus entirely on teaching them these 36 essential techniques. This realization led to the birth of the Gracie Combatives course. The techniques featured in this course have been adopted by the U.S. Army, Navy Seals, Secret Service, FBI, and countless other law enforcement agencies around the world".

Here we go (again)

[jubaji]

Strong Marketingfu

[Tant01]

Lol

It has been for a long time.
Overall the quality of the fads are going up, I think.

Anything less than ten years out of date is still new to us slower wood folks...

How long has Gracie Combatives been sold to the public like this?

Look... you can get your blue belt in combatives now...???

Whup...

[DJColdfusion]

I am not a Rorion fan. Anyone that will sue family members (named "Gracie" for teaching "Gracie Jiu-Jitsu" has a few issues IMHO. However, the Gracie combatives stuff has been around for better than a decade. I don't know when the term was trademarked but its not a "new" thing.

In general, I agree with the idea behind the thread that everyone and everything is trying to cash in on the "combatives" idea. Its really not much different than the TMA instructors who claimed to learn super secret techniques from super-human instructors. Many people identified with the "tradition" and mysticism that many TMAs market themselves as being a part of. Now, with the world as it is, people are identifying with another cultural icon, the military, and are gravitating towards what they believe will give them the ability to protect themselves.

Many in the industry are little more than privateers trying to cash in wherever they can . . .

[Guest]

As Marketing is my job, I have always stood back and marvelled at the world of martial arts advertising. More than any industry I can think of, even including fashion and entertainment, it is the most unbelievable crock of festering horseshit I have ever seen. Every once in a while I pick one of the mags and have a look at the adverts, and it just astonishes me what people actually get away with.

"I can teach you how to fight like a Ninja SAS Thai Boxing Assassin BJJ Killer type guy....and all this, from the comfort of your armchair! With my 67 DVD home study set you'll learn how to kill a man with a rotating bow tie, and then you'll screw his wife, guaranteed! Order now and receive a new larger pair of underpants, because when you've finished my course, your new big dick is gonna need it!"

or

"Our streets have become a warzone. The next time you step out of your front door, the enemy is will be waiting for you, you have to ask yourself how ready are you? If you haven't trained on my program, then you aren't ready, in fact you're not a man, I think you probably wear dresses and suck cock. Give me all your money, I'll tell you some stories about bar fights, shout at you loads and teach you some shit boxing, then you too will be a streetfighter. So to summarise - give me all your money."

You know what the sad thing is? It works. You know whats even sadder? The reason it works is because this is exactly what most people in martial arts want to hear.


If I had to write a real martial arts advert, it would probably read like this:

"You'll be given an athletic base first and foremost, whether you like it or not. If you'd like to learn how to protect yourself thats no problem, its actually pretty quick and straightforward, and I'm sorry but there aren't any secrets or magic involved. If you want to be a streetfighter or a knifefighter then go buy a knife and sod off to a street somewhere and have a fight. Yes I do teach Military and Police programs, but you aren't a Solider or a Cop, so stop wearing combats and carrying batons, grow up and learn how to fight. Are you going to get hit? Oh hell yeah, lots, but you'll get to hit me lots too. What do you need to do to be an instructor? Be an instructor, thats what. How long will it take? Years probably. How much do I charge? I don't charge anything, just come down to the gym or to my house and lets mix it up, but you have to help me train too. Thats the deal. So, you interested? No of course not, you've just ordered your 67 DVD home study set. Well good luck, I hope you enjoy baggy underwear."

I'm pleased to say that in a martial arts sense, my marketing sucks

[kingoftheforest]

On a pirates shoulder.

Funny about marketing, because I was told I would have to lose my ego. Train everyday learn to eat right and carry on a physical fitness regime or none of the above would matter.

I was told that if I trained and kept my awareness up that I would be less likely to be in a fight on the street. I was told fighting was for self defense only and that petty squabbles were for children and immature idiots out trying to prove something.

I was told pay what I could afford even if some periods of time that meant $0 as long as I could prove I had been training everyday.

I was told all the shit you see on T.V. and movies was just that shit. There was no mystical magical or supernatural B.S. involved in learning or studying martial arts.

I've learned more about fighting, being an adult, and have matured more from studying under this so much more than I have from any DVD or McDojo I studied with before.

And all this from OMG you guessed it BoarSpear.

Sun Tzu says if "You are in the majority you are most likely wrong"

I agree. Marketing is a way to make money. If you're in it for money you're in it for the wrong reason. Having lots of money makes you soft. Soft people aren't warriors and martial arts and fighting are what warriors do.

Street thugs learn to fight show they can show off to their friends and pump up their egos. Athletics only pertain to martial arts because you can't be 10lbs of monkey shit in a 5lb bag and be taken seriously. If you train on a daily basis you will have a better physique, if you sit on your ass all day and count your money or watch your DVD's and don't train you'll be the aforementioned bag of monkey crap.

If you don't train you may be able to read and parrot ideas but when someone asks you a real question or presents a technical problem you'll only make yourself look like an ass when you can't answer.

[jubaji]

Sun Tzu says if "You are in the majority you are most likely wrong"

Where did he say that?

[Tant01]

How slow am I?

...
How long has Gracie Combatives been sold to the public like this?

....

How long has GC been a Regestered Trademark?

[kingoftheforest]

The fact that everything you have listed is past tense enough to be proof itself.

And maybe you could show your maturity by not derailing threads to call people out in the open forum.

As you said you guilty of being a fit thrower too, especially when people call you out.

You also throw fits when people point out what you are clearly saying is B.S. the only difference is you have the ability to ban people or lock threads when you are show as being immature and inflating your ego on the boards.


And pointing out your hypocrisy and nonsense may be throwing a fit to you and the cronies and lackeys you have on here (which encompass much of the forum) but there are people who don't agree with you.

I've learned that when you claim you're not looking for a fight that's exactly what you are looking for.

So let me show my maturity right now by placing you on ignore and don't expect me to respond to you cause that's what adults do.

[kingoftheforest]

Guess I'll have to do it manually since I can't place you on ignore.

bye bye.

[jubaji]

LOL! Too funny! The non-pushing-button button has been pushed and the non-fit fit has been thrown. Very high level stuff.


My how you have changed! I guess braiding Boring's hair all day has really brought you inner piece!


...or not.

[Tant01]

How long has GC been a Regestered Trademark?

No one's going to point out my spelling error?

*Registered trademark since when again?

[Tant01]

Off topic!

When did Gracie trademark his so called "combatives"???

And since KOTF is off on another hissy fit I'll just kindly ask him to clarify what he means (exactly) by BS (Boar Spear) helping him become a real human being?

Is it that it developes a sense of responsibility...? Having kids will do that too.

Does art become your "way of being" your way of "doing" things? Does the physical destruction give you an appreciation for well being? Do words frustrate you to the point that you can no longer function rationally? Is that "mature"???

How easily we resort to the frog brain by PERCEIVED threats! Reality check? You're READING me.

No harm at all outside of some emotional attachment we have placed on VIRTUAL reality???

Think about it?

Keep things in perspective... Mike is just some pretty boy GI on the Internet, right?

You've never shook his hand? Looked him in the eye? Met his wife and kid?

You don't know jack about me but I consider you (and Boar) my e-buddies. I would never "attack" you personally over some internet forum...

How have you grown as civilized hominid at the hands of your master?

Seriously, do tell?

[kingoftheforest]

In one's own words

You have come in and been a bigger man. You have posted some really interesting stuff. I'd like to think I do that too, but I also realize people are going to shit on me from time to time, and that it comes with the turf. When you're standing out in front putting your views on display, every critic in the world shows up to try to tear them down. It's what critics do. But it doesn't cheapen any of the contributions I've made.

Look, man, I've been really impressed with the maturity of your posts, and I am extremely grateful for your decision to share some of your knowledge. That's sincere and from the heart. I haven't been hitting you with positive rep points because I want you to feel unwelcome. I want you to see that I appreciate your contributions both publicly and privately.

You came back a new man, and one of the best forum members I can think of. Even when we disagree, you're a model of civility lately.

Respects,
MB

Hey Bro,
I just wanted to say thanks for trying to keep the discussion on track in darian's thread. While I'm at it, I also want to say I'm sorry for lumping you in with others in the past. I've been reading your stuff lately, and you really are adding to the forums. You've been really positive and constructive, and there's a two-way flow of ideas that's really impressive. In the past, I felt like you jumped on the bandwagon with whomever was going after me at the time, so I went after you as a matter of interception. Maybe you did from time to time, but that didn't make me right. Lately, your posts have taken on a whole new personality, and I'm finding myself reading and enjoying your material more than ever. I try to be big enough to admit when I've wronged someone, and I feel I wronged you by writing you off on many occasions without merit. I apologize for doing so in the past, and I humbly tell you that I'll be reading your posts with real interest in the future, whether we agree or not. At any rate, kudos, and it's good to see a spike in the intelligence and education level on the boards as a result of your recent activity.

Humbly and Respectfully,
MB

At no point in my post did I say I was more mature than anyone person all I said is that I have become more mature. Seems to me Mike Brewer agrees with that since these are all real PM's I recieved from him in the last year.

There were also several telling me to ignore the idiots or people who like to poke and prod.

If my response wasn't to your liking it doesn't make it a fit. Being honest is a sign of maturity I gave you an honest answer.

Boar may not seem like a mature person because he fought what you had to say with the same attitude you and your underlings on here gave him. Why should he ignore what you say and allow you to run rampant on him.

I ignore members on here who continue to belittle me and call me a homosexual if it keeps up believe me there is a mature way to handle it and I have no problem taking that route.

When was the last time I "got into it" with any member on this forum? There have been several threads I posted once or twice in and when they headed into a childish or argumentative direction that was not constructive I left.

So once again the hypocrisy shows.

Like I said, bro:

Talk to the people who are listening and ignore the idiots. What's the old saying? "In order to provide light, one must endure burning?"

So who determines who I should ignore. I don't think I need to ask permission to decide for myself. Which is it? Answer everyone or ignore people who I feel are wasting my time?

You seem to be contradicting yourself a lot on these boards.

I have admitted openly that I was not and am not always the most mature person...but show me who here is?

Maturity is an ongoing process that should never stop just like learning.

If you take my responses as a hissy fit then spin them however you want that's fine. Just know that when I originally said I'd ignore you I was taking your advice. Doesn't seem like I want to follow that route given the evidence of character here.


And Tant I could never perceive anything you say as other than genuine and I get the feeling I would know if you meant it as a threat. I know you from places other than this.

Off topic!
And since KOTF is off on another hissy fit I'll just kindly ask him to clarify what he means (exactly) by BS (Boar Spear) helping him become a real human being?

Is it that it developes a sense of responsibility...? Having kids will do that too.

Does art become your "way of being" your way of "doing" things? Does the physical destruction give you an appreciation for well being? Do words frustrate you to the point that you can no longer function rationally? Is that "mature"???

How easily we resort to the frog brain by PERCEIVED threats! Reality check? You're READING me.

No harm at all outside of some emotional attachment we have placed on VIRTUAL reality???

Think about it?

Keep things in perspective... Mike is just some pretty boy GI on the Internet, right?

You've never shook his hand? Looked him in the eye? Met his wife and kid?

You don't know jack about me but I consider you (and Boar) my e-buddies. I would never "attack" you personally over some internet forum...

How have you grown as civilized hominid at the hands of your master?

Seriously, do tell?

Having children did help a lot, and every bit of good advice about raising my son came from Boar. I had shitty examples for parents and my mother and father-in-law have admitted they aren't the ones to ask for advice. Everyone in the family says my child is the most aware most well behaved out of all of them and he's 2 years old.

If people want to hear my response in there head as me being frustrated that's fine they can spin it how they want. A whole lot of that goes on around here. You're right for all we know Brewer could just be a chairborne warrior wanna be, but he banned Boar for calling his character out, so should I just allow him to call mine out and shrug my shoulders, while he gives people advice on poisoning patrons of the establishment they work it. Then tries to play it off as a joke weeks later? Mentally unstable people do crazy shit. People backed into corners like the guy who posted may take this stuff literally don't you think Tant?


Boar has told me many times that my temper will hurt me and that I needed to control it. For a while he refused to teach me because of it.

It really came into perspective when he told me it would effect my son because kids are "monkey see, monkey do".


People can take this as a fit if they want but I'm cool as a cucumber right now. And if I was taking my ball and going home I would've stopped posting here a looong time ago.

It's not taking my ball and leaving it's like my mom used to say "You are who you associate with" so I choose not to associate with certain people that I feel my harm my reputation with their bad advice or foolishness. And that my friend is a matter of opinion and I am allowed to hold whatever opinion I want.

Some people may confuse passion for what you believe in as being anger and frustration but those are people of little minds. I may not have been the model citizen and I have a ways to go, however I feel I have grown and the people around me do too, that's all I need.


What I don't understand is how ignoring people isn't mature (even though I was told it was) appealing to the Mods isn't mature, and answering the fools back isn't mature.

So Tant tell me what is mature? What course of action is considered to be mature?

I'm directing this to you because out of everyone here other than Tom Yum you are a model of maturity in my eyes.

[jubaji]

if it keeps up believe me there is a mature way to handle it and I have no problem taking that route.

Is that 'route' posting really long bitch sessions? Nice route, you're doing well.