Mixed Martial Bullshitters

[HtTKar]

Garland that's true. Dempsey was a great fighter in his time. Then he decided that he was going to start teaching, but he didn't know where to start, so he traced his past back: He had to find his roots. See, he thought he was a natural born boxer, but found there is no such thing, it all comes from the dozens of people that help you develope your skills. He boxed at a time of transition. Most of his trainers were old-school bare-knuckle boxers. In that time you had to be able to KO a person with either hand with a falling-step jab. Yes a jab. As he stated in his book "Championship boxing"

"And just as soon as savvy the knockout punch, I'll take you along through other departments of fighting. When you finish these instructions, you'll know exactly how to be a well-rounded scrapper. You'll be able to use your fist so destructively and practically that, with experience, you'll be able to move into amateur and even professional competition if you so desire. Should you go into competition you'll have a big advantage in all-round fighting knowledge over most boys who came up during the past quarter century. "

The thing was, is that during this transition, boxers changed their guard, their punches and everything. Boxing became more of a point system, and less off a last-man standing system.

Dempsey was the real deal. His fighting was so effective...and not many people know this but he was the first to train the National Guard special forces. Even while he was teaching, all this information was slowly being lost to the popularity of the point-system sport. Old-school boxing is much different than boxing with gloves. Western boxing has the same punches as every MA, including MT, it's how they are used and developed that's different.

[HtTKar]

PS
I have half the book and am willing to share it with anybody, just PM me your email address. (Electronic form, .doc OFFENSE)

I would be much ablidged if someone would share the second half with me
Defense.
I am missing chapters 1-3, and 20 on up.

Edit:
You dont need to send your email address. I uploaded this to a shared server. Just let me know if you want the link.

[MuayThaiFighter]

Koto-ryu, If you've got a copy of Dempsey's book, guard it with your life. I've been looking for a reasonable priced one for years. The cheapest I can ever find it is for $250. If you've got any sources for finding a less expensive copy, please let me know.

$250 for a book!!!!!!!!! It better be made of gold because that's expensive.I don't care how popular someone is or how good a book it is,I would never spend that kind of money on a book.

[koto_ryu]

PS
I have half the book and am willing to share it with anybody, just PM me your email address. (Electronic form, .doc OFFENSE)

I would be much ablidged if someone would share the second half with me
Defense.
I am missing chapters 1-3, and 20 on up.

Edit:
You dont need to send your email address. I uploaded this to a shared server. Just let me know if you want the link.

If I can squeeze the time in, I'll definitely try to hook you up Ht. As for Chapter 3, check your PMs.

[HtTKar]

Thank you Koto, I made a mistake. I actually have chapter 3. Got it from the same source. In fact, reading those threads is how I found this forum. If you ever get a chance to read their boxing articals you should make a day of it. They have a lot of stuff archived too. Thank you for helping. Is chapter 1&2 just introduction material? Still hoping to find the second half of the book on defense.
You know, I wish they'd reprint this book. I'm sure their would be many people willing to buy a reprint. The originals would still hold their value too. Dempsey knew how to break techniques down to their simplist form. For example the powerline punches make so much sense, but in truth they have been forgotten.

[Tant01]

$250 for a book!!!!!!!!! It better be made of gold because that's expensive.I don't care how popular someone is or how good a book it is,I would never spend that kind of money on a book.

Some things are worth more to people than gold....

[koto_ryu]

Some things are worth more to people than gold....

Especially when applying the proper training is like a Ph.D. in punching Dempsey wrote down over 384 pages analyzing his techniques before he put pen to paper, so obviously there's probably a valuable tidbit or two in there

[Uncle Corny]

the moral of this absurdly long thread: none of you queebs can fight.

[MuayThaiFighter]

Some things are worth more to people than gold....

True enough but that is going a little overboard in my opinion.I love my martial arts alot,it means everything to me but I would never spend that kind of money to buy a book on martial arts or some famous martial artist.

[koto_ryu]

the moral of this absurdly long thread: none of you queebs can fight.

..............................................
(Copyrighted jubaji, 2004. All rights reserved.)

[Tom Yum]

The Karate argument...

I agree to disagree with MTF on this. I think Muay Thai is an awesome art and probably one of the best stand up arts out there but karate isn't too shabby either.

Karate represents soo many different styles. I have met karate guys that can fight really well. Again, like other traditional arts not everyone joins for the reason of becoming a good fighter - sometimes they just want to build discipline and stay in shape, while learning some self-defense secondarily.

The dudes that join karate to learn to fight and want to fight, will become good fighters. No ifs, ands or buts about it.

[EmptyneSs]

I agree to disagree with MTF on this. I think Muay Thai is an awesome art and probably one of the best stand up arts out there but karate isn't too shabby either.

Karate represents soo many different styles. I have met karate guys that can fight really well. Again, like other traditional arts not everyone joins for the reason of becoming a good fighter - sometimes they just want to build discipline and stay in shape, while learning some self-defense secondarily.

The dudes that join karate to learn to fight and want to fight, will become good fighters. No ifs, ands or buts about it.

yeah i agree.

[Tant01]

"The efficiency of the art depends on the skilful application of theoretical knowledge developed upon the experience of centuries".
Gunji Koizumi

[opeth]

bullshitters

hey
i started reading this post
i didnt even read it all so this may have already come up
and im not goin to check back to see any reply
so any martial art, or point you are not familiar with,
just look it up

but some one kept saying that muay thai is the most practical fighting style
and that any grappling is only good when mixed with muay thai
well first off, just want to say im not bashin any one or any martial art
just tryin to give out some possibly interesting facts
and i am a firm believer that it is not the martial art but the artist that makes a good fighter
that being said

first, for the people who said that grappling is not very practical if not mixed with muay thai,
well here is some information that may make you reconsider
then again it may not..
"shuai chiao" or "chinese fast wrestling" martial used by all chinese police
"combat sambo" used by all red army (ussr) and russian army members
and most of if not all the slavic nations armies and police forces.
reasons for these is because they are effective and easy to learn

As for muay thai being the most practical
well im not exactly sure was is ment by this, if its the art that you can learn quickly and be able to defend yourself on the street with
then i would say muay thai probably would not be the most practical
because it does take a while to gain enough flexibility to throw high kicks,
and to be good enough to actually use them, id say what 6 - 12 months?
maybe more, but if you just learned the elbow, kneeing and punching aspect then i guess yes muay thai would be pratical, but that being said burmese boxing would be slightly more practical with headbutting being included.

however if by most practical
you mean after mastering, or becoming exceptional at any martial art
which would help you out the most in the street?
well as i said earlier i believe it is the artist that determines this
but you may want to take a look at "systema" it the martial practised by the elite russian special forces, or spestnaz (elite not all spestnaz, others were taught "combat sambo") also if you are exceptional at any martial art
then you should have no problem defending your self on the street against an untrained attacker.

one quick thing
if tae kwon do is so much inferior to muay thai as so many say
then why would the korean army and special forces use tae kwon do
why wouldnt they use muay thai?
doesnt seem to make much sense does it
please note that i do not think muay thai to be inferior to tae kwon do in any way either.

[Tant01]

hey
i started reading this post
i didnt even read it all so this may have already come up
and im not goin to check back to see any reply
so any martial art, or point you are not familiar with,
just look it up

....as i said earlier i believe it is the artist that determines this
but you may want to take a look at "systema" it the martial practised by the elite russian special forces, or spestnaz (elite not all spestnaz, others were taught "combat sambo") also if you are exceptional at any martial art
then you should have no problem defending your self on the street against an untrained attacker.

Systema, huh? As you say it's the artist, not the art. Especially not the system...

A little too "Marvel Comics" for me. Despite their best efforts to legitimize a history or lineage to SOMETHING it still only goes back as far as the KGBeast from the BATMAN Comic book (1950's?) that used something called "the system" aka SYSTEMA But you don't have to take my word for it.