extremisn in the shiite faith. warning, graphic images.

[DickHardman]

as some of you know, i was born here in america, but both my parents are from iran and when i was 12-13 my mom took me over there for a year were we stayed in irans capitol, tehran. iran really isnt as bad as they make it sound over here. however, i one thing i do remember seeing that was somehwat disturbing was the mourning rituals displayed during the shiite holiday of ashura. during this holiday, shiite muslims hold long prosessions through the street were they beat drums and inflict pain on themselves in order to commemorate imam hussein who was brutally martyred for his faith many years ago. now, i didnt see the worst of it, i only saw people beating themselves with chains. tehran is the most modern part of the country so people are a bit more educated and chiller, but man in some parts this prossession gets very gruesome, almost sadistic as men slash their own backs and heads and let themselves bleed in order to feel some of the pain that imam hussein did. here i included some pictures of some of these people, its pretty graphic. let me assure you though, like most extremists, these people are not the majority of people in iran, so please dont think all people in iran are crazy. thx.

i just dont understand what compels some people to go so far. its like, wouldnt you rather play a video game, drink some beers, or try to hang out with a hot chick than do go nuts and harm yourself/others?

[Tom Yum]

Some Catholics in the Philippines do a similar practice for Passover?

Some voluntarily crucify themselves, as a symbolic means of sharing in Jesus's pain and suffering for our sins.

That's pretty hard-core...

[DickHardman]

Some Catholics in the Philippines do a similar practice for Passover?

Some voluntarily crucify themselves, as a symbolic means of sharing in Jesus's pain and suffering for our sins.

That's pretty hard-core...

thats pretty messed up too. do these people really feel as if they are advancing themselves spiritually by harming themselves in such extreme ways?

[7r14ngL3Ch0k3]

This is what i think.

[Tom Yum]

There are strange people in all religions, cultures and subgroups.

subgroups like defend.net...we're a strange bunch at times!

[J-Luck]

I would never go to these extremes, but I certainly do commend anyone who is deeply convicted and is not hypocritical about their faith. I'm a born again protestant Christian, and sometimes people say IM a radical. The term is relative at best.

[bigboywasim]

I am a Muslim but I am Sunni. This is against Islam period. Not all Shia go to this level but they do practice this to some point. This never happened in my prophet's time. A lot of the prophet's close relatives and friends died for Islam, simply because of their belief. We Muslims didn't do these kinds of acts then nor should we do them now. Don't get me wrong all Muslims love the prophet and his family more than life it is just that this is against Islam. The Shia do this because they are angry at themselves because they could of stopped the prophet's grandson form such a horrible death but by mistake didn't. They take the anger out on themselves.

[jubaji]

Are we gonna get into sectarian strife right here on the forum?

[DickHardman]

Don't get me wrong all Muslims love the prophet and his family more than life it is just that this is against Islam. The Shia do this because they are angry at themselves because they could of stopped the prophet's grandson form such a horrible death but by mistake didn't. They take the anger out on themselves.

you obviously dont like shiites. you gotta give props to imam ali though, he was one of the greatest warriors of his time and his blade was legendary.

"Zulfiqar (Dhu'l-Fiqar) (Arabic: ذو الفقار) was the sword of Ali. The scimitar is one of the oldest and best known symbols of Islam, as important to Muslims as Excalibur is to the British [citation needed].

Ali's son, Imam Husayn bin Ali, used Zulfiqar against the Umayyad caliph Yazid I in the Battle of Karbala, where he and his family became martyrs. As a symbol of honour and knighthood, Zulfiqar has appeared in the iconography of Islamic nations for centuries, and was used extensively by the Abbasid Caliphate and the Ottoman Empire. Multiple conflicting images of the sword exist. Some show two parallel blades to emphasize its mystical abilities and speed, while others portray a more traditionally-shaped scimitar and still others depict a split, V-shaped blade. The Shi'a, who believe Ali was the first rightful successor to Muhammad, consider the sword to be as exceptional a weapon as Ali was a knight. Their saying, "La fatà illa Ali, la saif illa Zulfiqar" ( لا فتى إلا على لا سيف إلا ذو الفقار ), "there is no hero except Ali, there is no sword except (his sword) Zulfiqar", was frequently inscribed on new weapons. The sword was presented to Ali by Allah in the Battle of Uhud. Ali with the help of this Zulfiqar defended the Prophet Muhammad and won the lost battle for the Muslims, after which the above mentioned phrase was recited

About

The name is variously explained, but is generally thought to mean "cleaver of the spine" [1], "the two-pronged one" or "double-edged one". It is sometimes also interpreted as "sharp distinction between right and wrong" or "the one who distinguishes between right and wrong", or "trenchant".

According to legend, Ali used the sword to slice an opponent and his horse in half. The opponent was Amr ibn Abdawud, His strength was compared to the strength of 1000 men. He was so brave that no one dared to fight him except Ali, who killed him with just one blow. Though Amr wore a cone-shaped helmet to avoid swords' knocks over the head, this was no match for Zulfiqar."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ali#Zulfiqar

[bigboywasim]

you obviously dont like shiites. you gotta give props to imam ali though, he was one of the greatest warriors of his time and his blade was legendary.

I never said that I do not like Shiites. All Muslims are brothers and sisters. I think this Shia/Sunni hate crap needs to end. I gave the reason why this kind of behavior seen in the pics is wrong that Shiites do, that doesn't mean I hate Shiites. I believe most people will agree with me that this behavior is wrong.

[gregimotis]

Are we gonna get into sectarian strife right here on the forum?

Well, at least it'd be a different kind of strife than we normally get into...

[gregimotis]

All Muslims are brothers and sisters.

All muslims excepting the ones blowing up each others mosques, presumably.

[DickHardman]

I never said that I do not like Shiites. All Muslims are brothers and sisters. I think this Shia/Sunni hate crap needs to end. I gave the reason why this kind of behavior seen in the pics is wrong that Shiites do, that doesn't mean I hate Shiites. I believe most people will agree with me that this behavior is wrong.

saying shiites are mad at themselves for the death of imam hussein is a pretty inflammatory remark bro, very disrespectful.

thats like if i was to blame sunnis for killing the prophets family.

[bigboywasim]

saying shiites are mad at themselves for the death of imam hussein is a pretty inflammatory remark bro, very disrespectful.

thats like if i was to blame sunnis for killing the prophets family.

I don't mean any disrespect just saying the truth. You are twisting my words. I did not say that Shittes killed the prophet's family. I said they wanted to protect his family but couldn't protect the way they wanted to.

[gregimotis]

I don't mean any disrespect just saying the truth. You are twisting my words. I did not say that Shittes killed the prophet's family. I said they wanted to protect his family but couldn't protect the way they wanted to.

DH was making a comparative analogy, not twisting your words. Let me try another one:


If I said "The Jews killed Jesus" that would be technically true (according to the bible); However, it would still be disrespectful. If I said "Muslims attacked New York City" that would also be technically true - they were Muslims - but it would also insult the millions of muslims world-wide not involved.

Point is, just because it's a fact doesn't make it true... Or not disrespectful.