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  • Any U.S. strike might not destroy Iran nuclear sites

    Any U.S. strike might not destroy Iran nuclear sites

    By Kristin Roberts Fri Feb 23, 2:06 PM ET

    WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Any U.S. attack against
    Iran could involve thousands of sorties and missile launches lasting weeks, but it still would not eliminate the country's nuclear program, U.S. military officials and analysts say.


    A strike -- something the
    Pentagon insists is not planned -- would be hampered by lack of intelligence on the number and location of nuclear facilities dispersed throughout Iran, the analysts said.

    And the most sophisticated U.S. "bunker-buster" bombs might be unable to dig deep enough to reach buried, hardened nuclear sites, according to analysts and defense officials.

    "It is highly unlikely all the critical sites are known to U.S. and Western intelligence services, so parts of the program would doubtless survive, perhaps even the most critical elements," said Bruce Riedel, a former National Security Council and Defense Department official, and now a Brookings Institution analyst.

    An air strike, raised as the most likely option if any military action were ordered, would at best set Iran's nuclear program back a few years.

    "The people who are most optimistic favor it because they think it will delay, not derail, the Iranian nuclear program," said Justin Logan, a Cato Institute analyst in Washington.

    Many officials and military analysts say a U.S. attack on Iran is unlikely. The U.S. military is stretched thin by wars in
    Afghanistan and
    Iraq, and there is little international support for it.

    U.S. officials consistently stress diplomacy as the best way to resolve the dispute over Iran's nuclear program, which the United States and others say Tehran is using to develop nuclear weapons. Iran denies the charge, saying it seeks only peaceful nuclear energy.

    Despite the Bush administration's focus on talks, military maneuvers and the rhetoric coming from Washington and Tehran have fostered speculation about an armed confrontation.

    WEAK INTELLIGENCE HURTS OPTIONS

    Defense officials who spoke on condition of anonymity in broad terms about military options, mentioned alternatives ranging from limited air strikes to a more sustained air campaign. Analysts offer more detail, but acknowledge their assessments are only an educated guess.

    The officials say a U.S. strike would target Iran's known nuclear facilities and other military installations, including missile sites and anti-aircraft systems.

    It would involve bomber aircraft dropping bunker-buster bombs to hit the underground nuclear sites, defense officials and analysts said. Another component would be cruise missiles launched from U.S. naval vessels in the Gulf, they added.

    Some military officials have discussed a campaign that could involve hundreds of sorties over a few days. But some scenarios that expand targets to other government and weapons facilities could require thousands of sorties over many weeks, analysts said.

    Analysts and military officials in Washington said neither option was considered likely to wipe out Iran's nuclear program.

    The first problem is finding the targets. The Center for Strategic and International Studies analyst Anthony Cordesman has said that while international inspectors have identified at least 18 sites, there could be as many as 70.

    Beyond intelligence, U.S. munitions might not be able to do the job. Cato's Logan said the most effective U.S. bunker-buster bomb could not drill deep enough through hardened concrete and rock to hit nuclear facilities believed to be buried at least 15 meters (50 feet) underground.

    A series of sorties would be necessary with bombs guided repeatedly to the same site to inflict heavy damage.

    "Those limitations would clearly affect us," said one defense official.

    But Pentagon officials say the United States could damage Iran's nuclear program.

    "Clearly the United States has tremendous capability, but it has no intent and is not planning to go to war with Iran," said spokesman Bryan Whitman.

  • #2
    U.S. developing contingency plan to bomb Iran

    U.S. developing contingency plan to bomb Iran: report

    1 hour, 2 minutes ago

    NEW YORK (Reuters) - Despite the Bush administration's insistence it has no plans to go to war with
    Iran, a
    Pentagon panel has been created to plan a bombing attack that could be implemented within 24 hours of getting the go-ahead from
    President George W. Bush, The New Yorker magazine reported in its latest issue.


    The special planning group was established within the office of the Joint Chiefs of Staff in recent months, according to an unidentified former U.S. intelligence official cited in the article by investigative reporter Seymour Hersh in the March 4 issue.

    The panel initially focused on destroying Iran's nuclear facilities and on regime change but has more recently been directed to identify targets in Iran that may be involved in supplying or aiding militants in
    Iraq, according to an Air Force adviser and a Pentagon consultant, who were not identified.

    The consultant and a former senior intelligence official both said that U.S. military and special-operations teams had crossed the border from Iraq into Iran in pursuit of Iranian operatives, according to the article.

    In response to the report, Pentagon spokesman Bryan Whitman said: "The United States is not planning to go to war with Iran. To suggest anything to the contrary is simply wrong, misleading and mischievous.

    "The United States has been very clear with respect to its concerns regarding specific Iranian government activities. The president has repeatedly stated publicly that this country is going to work with allies in the region to address those concerns through diplomatic efforts," Whitman said.

    Pentagon officials say they maintain contingency plans for literally dozens of potential conflicts around the world and that all plans are subject to regular and ongoing review.

    The article, citing unnamed current and former U.S. officials, also said the Bush administration received intelligence from
    Israel that Iran had developed an intercontinental missile capable of delivering several small warheads that could reach Europe. It added the validity of that intelligence was still being debated.

    The article also included an interview conducted in December with Hezbollah leader Sayyed Hassan Nasrallah, who said that while he had no interest in initiating another war with Israel, he was anticipating and preparing for another Israeli attack sometime this year.

    Israel launched a cross-border offensive against Hezbollah in Lebanon last July.

    Nasrallah also said he was open to talks with Washington if such discussions "can be useful and influential in determining American policy in the region," but they would be waste of time if the purpose was to impose policy.

    Comment


    • #3
      I hope he doesn't bomb Iran.

      We're still not finished in Iraq; We didn't finish in Afghanistan - arguably a more important war against Al-Qaeda.

      An act of war against Iran, could trigger hostilities with Russia and China.

      We complain about 2,000 American casualties in Iraq...Iran would gladly sacrifice 20,000 fighters to stop an invasion of their homeland. They did it defending their border in the Iraq-Iran war and they'll do it again.

      If we draw Russia and China into it, say hello to the new draft, rediculous oil prices, inflation and WW3...
      Last edited by Tom Yum; 02-24-2007, 09:24 PM.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Tom Yum View Post
        I hope he doesn't bomb Iran.

        We're still not finished in Iraq; We didn't finish in Afghanistan - arguably a more important war against Al-Qaeda.

        An act of war against Iran, could trigger hostilities with Russia and China.

        We complain about 2,000 American casualties in Iraq...Iran would gladly sacrifice 20,000 fighters to stop an invasion of their homeland. They did it defending their border in the Iraq-Iran war and they'll do it again.

        If we draw Russia and China into it, say hello to the new draft, rediculous oil prices, inflation and WW3...
        Yep but we should support him, he's the president! Get in line and Shut up!! Don't worry about the problems at home we can clean them up after we clean up the bad guys overseas.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Tom Yum View Post
          I hope he doesn't bomb Iran.

          We're still not finished in Iraq; We didn't finish in Afghanistan - arguably a more important war against Al-Qaeda.

          An act of war against Iran, could trigger hostilities with Russia and China.

          We complain about 2,000 American casualties in Iraq...Iran would gladly sacrifice 20,000 fighters to stop an invasion of their homeland. They did it defending their border in the Iraq-Iran war and they'll do it again.

          If we draw Russia and China into it, say hello to the new draft, rediculous oil prices, inflation and WW3...
          wait till china invades taiwan. then we are really screwed.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by DickHardman View Post
            wait till china invades taiwan. then we are really screwed.
            What, do you think they read Sun Tzu or something? Just because it's evident we're in WAAAY over our heads and currently bogged down on 2 different fronts in two different wars, doesn't mean that our enemies would take advantage of our stretched to the breaking point armed forces.

            Comment


            • #7
              Iran ready for anything in nuclear dispute

              Iran ready for anything in nuclear dispute

              By Parisa Hafezi Sat Feb 24, 5:43 PM ET

              TEHRAN (Reuters) -
              Iran is ready for anything the United States does to stop its nuclear program, Tehran's foreign minister said on Saturday after the United States maintained it was keeping "all options on the table."


              The five permanent members of the
              United Nations Security Council plus Germany will meet in London next week to discuss whether to strengthen sanctions on Iran after it failed to meet a U.N. February 21 deadline to halt uranium enrichment.

              Iran insists it has the right to nuclear power to generate electricity, but the West suspects Tehran is really trying to building an atomic arsenal.

              While U.S. leaders say they want a diplomatic solution to the nuclear dispute with Iran, Washington officials are careful not to rule out military force to stop the Islamic Republic becoming a nuclear power.

              "We are ready for any possible option taken by America," Iranian Foreign Minister Manouchehr Mottaki told reporters.

              Once seen as vulnerable, squeezed between a U.S. military presence in both
              Iraq and
              Afghanistan, Iran is increasingly confident now that the Iraqi and Afghan insurgencies have tied up the United States in increasingly costly wars.

              "We do not see America in a position to impose another crisis on its tax-payers ... by starting another war in the Middle East," Mottaki said.

              But Vice President
              Dick Cheney, in talks with Australian Prime Minister John Howard, said the United States and its allies were pursuing diplomacy as their preferred course on Iran but repeated that "all options were on the table."

              "We believe it would be a serious mistake if a nation such as Iran were to become a nuclear power," he told reporters in Sydney.

              The Weekend Australian newspaper reported on Saturday that Cheney had endorsed U.S. Republican Senator John McCain (news, bio, voting record)'s proposition that the only thing worse than a military confrontation with Iran would be a nuclear-armed Iran.

              TALKS OR PUNISHMENT?

              The Daily Telegraph, citing an unnamed senior Israeli defense official, said on Saturday that
              Israel had sought U.S. permission to use an "air corridor" in Iraq if the Jewish state decided to launch air strikes on Iranian nuclear facilities.

              "We are planning for every eventuality, and sorting out issues such as these (airspace passage) are crucially important," the Daily Telegraph quoted the Israeli official, who spoke on condition of anonymity, as saying.

              "If we don't sort these issues out now we could have a situation where American and Israeli war planes start shooting at each other," he said.

              But Israeli Deputy Defense Minister Ephraim Sneh denied the report. "No such approach has been made -- that is clear," he told Israel Radio.

              "Those who do not want to take political, diplomatic, economic steps against Iran are diverting attention to the mission we are supposedly said to be conducting," Sneh said.

              Iran says it wants to negotiate with the Europeans and even Washington but refuses to give up its right to enrich uranium guaranteed by the nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty.

              "We want the London meeting to make a brave decision and resume talks with Iran to find a way to preserve Iran's right," Mottaki said.

              Western nations say the fact that Iran kept its nuclear program secret for 18 years until 2002 and its lack of cooperation with U.N. inspectors show its ill intent.

              The London meeting of Security Council members could add a travel ban on senior Iranian officials and restrictions on non-nuclear business to existing sanctions banning of transfers of nuclear technology.

              But harsher sanctions could face serious obstacles, as Russia, China and some EU powers prefer further dialogue with Iran to Washington's push to isolate and punish.

              ..........................................................

              Huh, the enemy seems to be paying attention after all, funny, I remember forum members blabbering how the Iraq and Afghanistan pincers were keeping Tehran in line....Seems to me we played DIRECTLY into their hands....Gee I sure the hope the rest of our enemies aint paying attention.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by DickHardman View Post
                wait till china invades taiwan. then we are really screwed.
                If we conduct war on three fronts (Iraq, Iran and Afghanistan), its going to polarize our nation in a war that is quickly loosing support from the folks who voted President Bush into power, as sooner rather than later, their own children could be filling in spots.

                I'm prepaired (even though I'm slightly above draft age), but are you - Garland? Dickhardman? Bjjexpertise? Are you guys ready to serve your country if your number gets called??

                Why? We are struggling to meet the manpower needs for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. The only other ways to meet the needs for a war on a third front is to either:

                1. Free up non-combat related soldiers and retrain them as combat arms, and make soldiering a more profitable profession for highschool/college graduates and up recruiting (recruiting trends show otherwise)...

                or

                2. Reinstate the draft.


                The government will take the easier, painless and cheaper path of the two.


                Also what will our allies or neutral competitors be doing?

                Israel?
                UK?
                EU?
                Australia?
                The Asian-Tiger nations?

                and more importantly China and Russia?

                China will gladly purchase secure, AAA grade Treasuries and Bonds from the U.S. if we expand war into Iran. If this happens, they could practically walk across the strait and pick up Taiwan with little recourse...not only because they are one of our biggest creditors, but also because their navy and army are large and the strongest they've ever been.

                I don't think this will happen overnight, but after the 2008 Olympics - I guarantee the EU will be doubling their efforts to get on China's good side for access to commerce and may be willing to no longer recognize Taiwan as an independent nation.

                Many of our own nations CEOs are deeply infatuated with China. And while the business benefits have been mutual, it could put is in a conflict of interest some day.
                Last edited by Tom Yum; 02-26-2007, 02:25 AM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Tom Yum View Post
                  If
                  IF???? My last visit to the VA they asked if I was returning from Iran, Iraq, or Afghanistan...I've checked with other vets here around Special operations command and they all report the same thing...Its a standard screening question so the Doctors know what toxins to test us for...some of us that were there in the late 70's and early 80's are being called in to compare blood samples, presumably with the newer guys coming home...gee I wonder what they're looking for in our blood?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by BoarSpear View Post
                    Do you think they read Sun Tzu or something?
                    Sun Tzu's book was seen as esoteric and "foreign" by mainstream until the late 80's and early 90's, I think.
                    Last edited by Tom Yum; 02-24-2007, 10:40 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      any of you guys happen to know how effective the tor-m1 missles that russia just gave iran are? do they pose a real threat to our air force?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Tom Yum View Post
                        Sun Tzu's book was seen as esoteric and "foreign" by mainstream until the late 80's and early 90's, I think.
                        Well our enemies directly used and required the study of Sun Tzu during the Vietnam War. That was the late 60's early 70's.

                        Ernesto 'Che' Guevara also used Sun Tzu's teachings extensively when helping Castro win Cuba and later in Central America...Che also included a heavy dose of Sun Tzu in his own Manuscript (Guerrilla Warfare) which is a bible on running an insurgency and VERY popular with our enemies. You'll find our enemies in the middle east are now cooperating with our enemies in the P.I. and such...that can only spell trouble, trust me.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Tom Yum View Post

                          1. Free up non-combat related soldiers and retrain them as combat arms, and make soldiering a more profitable profession for highschool/college graduates and up recruiting (recruiting trends show otherwise)...
                          Uh dude, they're ALREADY taking sailors off ships and Shore duty (that means you spend 6-9 months at sea away from your family, then when you get home they send you to play soldier in the sand) ...Recruiters are being busted WEEKLY now for signing people incapable of performing their duties...Soldiers aren't being allowed to get out when their time is up and old retired soldiers are being forced to return to service...


                          Originally posted by Tom Yum View Post
                          2. Reinstate the draft.
                          I can't wait. Interesting note there is NEW anti gun legislation being worked on suddenly ...those darn Democrats.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Tom Yum View Post

                            I'm prepaired (even though I'm slightly above draft age), but are you - Garland? Dickhardman? Bjjexpertise? Are you guys ready to serve your country if your number gets called??
                            when people bug me about picking a career, or what im going to do with myself, i usually tell them not to worry about it because im probably going to be employed by the us army sometime in the near future the way things have been going.

                            guerillas have effectively pinned our forces in iraq, and they have succeeded in drained our financial recourses greatly, a major goal of guerillas.

                            whats gonna happen once we have to face a global power?? its almost guaranteed that we will. history repeats itself like it has in iraq, and it will repeat itself again when we will have to deal with another large scale war that will require troops to be drafted.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by DickHardman View Post

                              whats gonna happen once we have to face a global power?? its almost guaranteed that we will. history repeats itself like it has in iraq, and it will repeat itself again when we will have to deal with another large scale war that will require troops to be drafted.
                              People are already less than thrilled with Bush now, his approval ratings seem to be in the 20's....what do you think the draft will do to those numbers? A country sick of a lying administration is not going to respond well to a draft after their last vote made it clear how they felt about his war.

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