Motivational Posters

[TTEscrima]

How well did Orlando Weit, a muay thai champion, do when he faced a judo champ? He got his ass kicked.

Now thats an understatement and a half, and the Judo guy dusted his ass with...elbows. LOL.

[jubaji]

your arguments seem to mostly consist of "i am right and you wouldnt know"

Bingo. That's TTExcrement's one tune as well.

[Uke]

its not a theory, its done to make the playing field as level as possible.

It's done to make it seem more competitive and give a show for the audience. When someone is much better they should be able to knock out their opponent almost immediately/ Mike Tyson used to do it in almost all of his fights when Cus was still alive. He would completely dominate his competition, and those who lasted longer only did so by jabbing and running. That's what any fight should look like.

Weight classes are just a device used to give a better show. As I said earlier, MMA started off by using no weight classes and those fights ended fast. There was more fighting and less jabbing and feeling each other out. If you think that jabbing and feeling each other out is real combat then you have absolutely no idea about combat. All that was before everyone began using the guard and used whatever original training they had.

How well did Orlando Weit, a muay thai champion, do when he faced a judo champ? He got his ass kicked. How well did Roland Payne, who also was a thaiboxer, do in his fight against a karate man? They were KO'd within minutes. So stop trying to make MT seem like its more formidable than it is. If the way you fight takes 12 rounds to end a bout then its folly to liken it to self defense.

come on its obvious, its there so you are competing against as physically similar opponents as possible. at higher levels this makes a difference.

What is a higher level than world championship competition? Weight classes are there so that the matches don't seem like toughman matches where the smaller opponent gets mauled by the bigger opponent.

in k1 the skill levels are usually less closely matched.

How are the skill levels any less closely match than in professional boxing and kickboxing? Every professional fighting sport has bums. I can't believe I have to explain this to you.

so tell me why you think there are weight classes in these fighting sports?

I have in detail but you just can't seem to grasp it.

also, where did you study thai boxing, and what is elbow conditioning?

I'm not a "thai boxer" but MT techniques are a part of the system I belong to. And if you seriously don't know what shin and forearm conditioning is as it pertains to muay thai then you are pretending to be something that you're clearly not.

[Ghost]

also, please tell me why yiou think boxing matches go on so long

[Ghost]

That's nonsense. Journeyman often fight champions as tune ups. Peter McNeeley was hardly close in terms of skill to Mike Tyson when they fought. When the guys from the contender get shots at elite boxers they aren't close in terms of skill. Vernon Forest took Shane Mosley apart. In his next bout he was beaten by a journeyman named Ricardo Mayorga, who Shane knocked out this year.

In fact, you seldom see two equally skilled fighter pitted against each other. When you do it looks like Gatti/Ward, Castillio/Corrales and Barrera/Morales. Fights like those seldom come along. In most cases its one boxer being showcased against an opponent. But then again that's the boxing business. Only someone who knows nothing about it would think that both fighters are equally skilled in most matches.

You really thought that nonsense about boxing, huh?

Most modern pioneers, from Kano to Ueshiba to Gaje to Helio Gracie to Bruce Lee to Nelson to Visitacion to Oyama to Oyata ... these were all small men who were able to defeat and subdue larger men. What these men did wasn't predicated on how large their opponent was. They were able to win, and quite quickly without long drawn out bouts.

That's something you just don't understand because you have little if any exposure to things outside or the perceived "fight game" of boxing/kickboxing and MMA. Of the names mentioned above you may recognize maybe two.

You could put the best 140lbs champion thaiboxer against a promising but much less experienced 200lbs rising star in K-1 and watch your theory fall apart right in front of you.

its not a theory, its done to make the playing field as level as possible.

come on its obvious, its there so you are competing against as physically similar opponents as possible. at higher levels this makes a difference.

in k1 the skill levels are usually less closely matched.

i cant believe we are even having this conversations.

so tell me why you think there are weight classes in these fighting sports?

also, where did you study thai boxing, and what is elbow conditioning?

[Uke]

its because they are so close in skill, obviously in the ring you have to have the same weight or its not an even contest. when you get 2 guys at almost the same skill level weight makes a huge difference.

you should know this its basic and the reason why there are weight classes.

That's nonsense. Journeyman often fight champions as tune ups. Peter McNeeley was hardly close in terms of skill to Mike Tyson when they fought. When the guys from the contender get shots at elite boxers they aren't close in terms of skill. Vernon Forest took Shane Mosley apart. In his next bout he was beaten by a journeyman named Ricardo Mayorga, who Shane knocked out this year.

In fact, you seldom see two equally skilled fighter pitted against each other. When you do it looks like Gatti/Ward, Castillio/Corrales and Barrera/Morales. Fights like those seldom come along. In most cases its one boxer being showcased against an opponent. But then again that's the boxing business. Only someone who knows nothing about it would think that both fighters are equally skilled in most matches.

You really thought that nonsense about boxing, huh?

Most modern pioneers, from Kano to Ueshiba to Gaje to Helio Gracie to Bruce Lee to Nelson to Visitacion to Oyama to Oyata ... these were all small men who were able to defeat and subdue larger men. What these men did wasn't predicated on how large their opponent was. They were able to win, and quite quickly without long drawn out bouts.

That's something you just don't understand because you have little if any exposure to things outside or the perceived "fight game" of boxing/kickboxing and MMA. Of the names mentioned above you may recognize maybe two.

You could put the best 140lbs champion thaiboxer against a promising but much less experienced 200lbs rising star in K-1 and watch your theory fall apart right in front of you.

[Ghost]

And by substance he means Youtube videos.

by substance i mean the ability to talk about technique and the ability to understand what you are looking at.

like your take on thai boxing being about conditioning the elbows and shins, though you claim you have studied it, you would know this is not true.

what the hell is shin and elbow conditioning?

I cant help but get the impression you are an armchair warrior.

you dont seem to have any real knowledge beyond saying what you think is crap and what is good.

your arguments seem to mostly consist of "i am right and you wouldnt know"

yet the few points you do come up with are consistent with other peoples experiences. i can clearly see you know nothing of boxing or thai boxing. In thailand it is common for people to fight in totally different weight classes other than at the higher levels at higher levels its not on. happens in the uk and usa as well as long as both sides agree to it, its pretty common. only when you get to area title level does it matter, though most fights are at the same weight. its certainly not a rule.


did you work out why boxing matches have weight classes yet and why they last 12 rounds?

this is my point, you dont understand why, cos you dont do martial arts...do you?

[Ghost]

Oh .. that was clever. The wonders of semantics yet again give hope to those who can't discuss the topic. Regardless as to how you word it, they aren't effective unless they are pitted against someone their size. If that wasn't so then no one would have to move up in weight when facing a larger opponent. What would be the point? If the smaller man could win while giving up 20-30lbs they would sell that fight as David Vs Goliath. They never do though, now do they?

In the event that a practitioner from one of the above systems does fight someone who is larger than them and loses ... they nearly ALWAYS blame it on the fact that they gave up how ever many pounds. Just look at Helio vs Kimura.

Just look at the heavyweight division in boxing. The division used to have quality. Now, they substitute that quality with giant boxers who should rightfully be considered super-heavyweights. The largest of them all, Valuev, is hardly the most skilled but with his incredible height of 7'0 he is very formidable. The Klitschkos are 6'6 and 6'7. Lennox Lewis was 6'5. This is why the division is wrought with awful fights. Everyone in that division is a terrible respresentation of what heavyweight boxing is supposed to be and they win based on their size and not their talent. When you think of heavyweight fights you think of Tyson, Holyfield, Holmes, Spinks, Ali, Foreman, Frazier, Liston, Marciano, Louis and Johnson. Not the clumsy and awkward giants we have today.

MMA showed us that once weight classes weren't a part of the equation it all looked like toughman contest. UFC I, II, III, IV, V, VI, VII, & VIII all had the original format that proved this point. Those were the best of what the UFC had to offer before weight classes and inhibiting rules were instituted because the whole concept of the UFC was to show truths in combat ... however possible that was in a controlled environment.

Great posters, TTE.

its because they are so close in skill, obviously in the ring you have to have the same weight or its not an even contest. when you get 2 guys at almost the same skill level weight makes a huge difference.

you should know this its basic and the reason why there are weight classes.

[Uke]

what im finding with these guys is a lot of talk and not a lot of substance.

And by substance he means Youtube videos.

[Uke]

no one trains in weight classes, they only fight in the ring in them. the day in day out training is with everyone in the gym of whatever weight they are.

another factor that is often overlooked by the anti-wieghtclass mob.

have you worked out why boxing matches can last 12 rounds yet?

Oh .. that was clever. The wonders of semantics yet again give hope to those who can't discuss the topic. Regardless as to how you word it, they aren't effective unless they are pitted against someone their size. If that wasn't so then no one would have to move up in weight when facing a larger opponent. What would be the point? If the smaller man could win while giving up 20-30lbs they would sell that fight as David Vs Goliath. They never do though, now do they?

In the event that a practitioner from one of the above systems does fight someone who is larger than them and loses ... they nearly ALWAYS blame it on the fact that they gave up how ever many pounds. Just look at Helio vs Kimura.

Just look at the heavyweight division in boxing. The division used to have quality. Now, they substitute that quality with giant boxers who should rightfully be considered super-heavyweights. The largest of them all, Valuev, is hardly the most skilled but with his incredible height of 7'0 he is very formidable. The Klitschkos are 6'6 and 6'7. Lennox Lewis was 6'5. This is why the division is wrought with awful fights. Everyone in that division is a terrible respresentation of what heavyweight boxing is supposed to be and they win based on their size and not their talent. When you think of heavyweight fights you think of Tyson, Holyfield, Holmes, Spinks, Ali, Foreman, Frazier, Liston, Marciano, Louis and Johnson. Not the clumsy and awkward giants we have today.

MMA showed us that once weight classes weren't a part of the equation it all looked like toughman contest. UFC I, II, III, IV, V, VI, VII, & VIII all had the original format that proved this point. Those were the best of what the UFC had to offer before weight classes and inhibiting rules were instituted because the whole concept of the UFC was to show truths in combat ... however possible that was in a controlled environment.

Great posters, TTE.

[Tant01]

.................

:d

[Ghost]

lol the JJ one is great.

[TTEscrima]

The Brazillians spell it Jiu Jitsu, theJapanese spell it Jujitsu or Ju jitsu or Ju Jit Su.

Oh I know all about the variations of spelling JJ, apparently you missed the misspelling I was talking about, seeing as to the content of the picture it's understandable though.

[Hardball]

JJ ain't all bad. At least not as bad as the spelling on the poster.

The Brazillians spell it Jiu Jitsu, theJapanese spell it Jujitsu or Ju jitsu or Ju Jit Su.

[Ghost]

Careful Ghost, you are asking questions too far beyond his ability to comprehend. He also has a lot of trouble with math.

im starting to think you might be right.

what im finding with these guys is a lot of talk and not a lot of substance.

im shocked by the general lack of knowledge, on the surface they appear to know what they are talking about but scratch it and there isnt much going on.

it was the comments about thai boxing being all about conditioning that got me worried.
after that ive been looking more closely and i dont believe there is any real training going on.

id be interested to see some detailed technique discussions from these guys.