Yes or No

[jubaji]

Um.........ok......

[Hermit]

Any war is a war of deception. This discussion is a waste of personal energy. What is war if not a waste of personal energy which is sanctioned by minds which have been deceived by themselves?
I am pro wanking but avoid emission, guys. Do cultivate your reproductive energy within you own system. Do not waste it unless you want to reproduce.
So, my recommendation: soldiers should live in celebacy meaning not to shoot your load unless your mind goes crazy. Then ,you must shoot!
Have a good one.

[Garland]

All Americans must go to charm and beauty school. That way, no one can call us "Ugly Americans" any longer. The Language we speak is ENGLISH...learn it...or LEAVE!

So...Brewer is for a gay america with no clean dishes, mowed lawns, or tacos. Sorry...I had to. I know, I know...poor taste. If you guys can't take a joke,

[Tom Yum]

2. We will withdraw our troops from all over the world, starting with Germany, South Korea and the Philippines. They don't want us there. We would station troops at our borders. No more sneaking through holes in the fence.

I heard there are plans for a wall to be constructed along the southern U.S.-Mexico border. Can't say if this is going to fruition.

3. All illegal aliens have 90 days to get their affairs together and leave. We'll give them a free trip home. After 90 days the remainder will be gathered up and deported immediately, regardless of who or where they are. France would welcome them..

Wouldn't this be better suited in Europe?

4. All future visitors will be thoroughly checked and limited to 90 day visits unless given a special permit.

Agreed.

5. No "students" over age 21. The older ones are the bombers. If they don't attend classes, they get a "D" and it's back home, baby.

Graduate and professional programs are made up of guys and gals from age 22-30. Examples are the masters in business admintstration (MBA), medical school, pharmacy school, dental school and advanced studies in other areas (sciences, engineering, math, social sciences etc.).

Most schools put students on academic probation if their grades are sagging. If they are a foreign student, they are usually here on a student visa. Any foreign student whose here on a student visa and gets D's is in a loose-loose situation.

6. The US will make a strong effort to become self sufficient energy wise. This will include developing non polluting sources of energy but may require a temporary drilling of oil in the Alaskan wilderness. The caribou will have to cope for a while..

Man, there's alot of interesting research in this area!

Don't forget the cost of replacing petroleum infrastructure with other energy harvesting plants or fueling stations. We will never be completely oil free, but we can be oil free in transportation and maybe power generation.

Cracking crude makes some really nice and reactive chemicals that our society and economy need. Until we can find something that is as abundant and economically useable as oil, we will depend on it. OPEC says that there are enough crude reserves to go another 60 years, but I'm not sure if they've accounted for technological advances in drilling and finding oil, unpredictable changes in population or wars.

8. If there is a famine or other natural catastrophe in the world, we will not "interfere". They can pray to Allah or whomever, for seeds, rain, cement or whatever they need. Besides, most of what we give them gets "lost" or is taken by their army. The people who need it most get very little, anyway...

I don't know the statistics for our help in Thailand, but I'd imagine that our donations were put to good use.

[BoarSpear]

I see a lot of people yelling for peace but I have not heard of a plan for peace. So, here's one plan:

1. The US will apologize to the world for our "interference" in their affairs, past & present. We will promise never to "interfere" again.

2. We will withdraw our troops from all over the world, starting with Germany, South Korea and the Philippines. They don't want us there. We would station troops at our borders. No more sneaking through holes in the fence.

3. All illegal aliens have 90 days to get their affairs together and leave. We'll give them a free trip home. After 90 days the remainder will be gathered up and deported immediately, regardless of who or where they are. France would welcome them.

4. All future visitors will be thoroughly checked and limited to 90 day visits unless given a special permit. No one from a terrorist nation would be allowed in. If you don't like it there, change it yourself, don't hide here. Asylum would not ever be available to anyone. We don't need any more cab drivers.

5. No "students" over age 21. The older ones are the bombers. If they don't attend classes, they get a "D" and it's back home, baby.

6. The US will make a strong effort to become self sufficient energy wise. This will include developing non polluting sources of energy but may require a temporary drilling of oil in the Alaskan wilderness. The caribou will have to cope for a while.

7. Offer Saudi Arabia and other oil producing countries $10 a barrelfor their oil. If they don't like it, we go someplace else.

8. If there is a famine or other natural catastrophe in the world, we will not "interfere". They can pray to Allah or whomever, for seeds, rain, cement or whatever they need. Besides, most of what we give them gets "lost" or is taken by their army. The people who need it most get very little, anyway.

9.
A. Ship the UN Headquarters to an island some place. We don't need the spies and fair weather friends here. Besides, it would make a good homeless shelter or lockup for illegal aliens.

B. Use the buildings as replacement for the twin towers.

10. All Americans must go to charm and beauty school. That way, no one can call us "Ugly Americans" any longer.

Now, ain't that a winner of a plan?

"The Statue of Liberty is no longer saying 'Give me your poor, your tired, your huddled masses.' She's got a baseball bat and she's yelling, 'You want a piece of me?'" - Robin Williams
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E-mail rules

[medic06]

to be honest with you I think both sides are basically disagreeing only on a few different points. The rest is just semantics (kind of like religion).

My personal view is that yes, we should fight enemies of our country. But I disagree to the means with which we are doing it.

Of course I'm not very well versed in politics. I have the typical scientist's adversion to politics.

[medic06]

the problem is you shouldn't come under fire, your views should be up for scrutiny. Unfortunately almost every thread so far has bogged down into differing semantics and wild accusations.

[medic06]

Martial arts and politics. . . .

[BoarSpear]

dude, operation paperclip...google it...its historical fact that gehlen ran the gelhen org...that became the BND BOTH were headed by GEHLEN a top NAZI...BND was a CIA startup project...we supplied the nazis....and the 20 million dollars to set his office up....he ran our intell game against the russians...thats running american CIA projects that covered an entire country and our safety.....you just refuse to admit it...its historical fact....until you admit that im done here....i wont let you run your game on me...you started this attack on me...your losing...now you wanna change discussions...either admit Gelhen was A top NAZI who we gave immunity and set up as the gelhen org or im through with this....you want to deny HISTORICAL FACT....now you sound like the people who deny the Nazi crimes.....youre deny fact because it doesnt suit your agenda....tough its a fact.

[BoarSpear]

Gehlen had not been some cloistered spy. His job had not been simply to coordinate the gathering of information. He had been a key leader of the work of fascist groups in the occupied East, such as the Iron Guard in Romania, the Latvian Vanagis and the Croatian Ustashe. These groups committed the most unimaginably brutal atrocities against 'Untermenschen', Jews, 'gypsies', Serbs and other Slavs and Orthodox Christians, as well as against anti-Nazis, both Communist and non-Communist, including various Nationalist groups, which resisted the Nazis. Gehlen was a leading war criminal.

Did Allen Dulles know all this? Of course he knew all this - he was a U.S. spymaster with almost three decades experience and he had worked with the Nazi leadership for years. Dulles arranged to have Gehlen secretly brought to the U.S. precisely so that the Russians wouldn't get hold of him and put him on trial for war crimes and hang him.

Once they had Gehlen safely in the U.S., Allen Dulles and other top U.S. Intelligence operatives met with Gehlen and planned a nightmare creation: a vast European spying-and-subversion apparatus, controlled by Washington but staffed by hundreds and then thousands of Nazi war criminals. The Nazis may have lost the war but Nazism had found new life. (6)

http://emperors-clothes.com/docs/gehlen2.htm

HMMMMM whats more believable, page after page of studies and documents that say America absorbed top nazis then set them up running our anti soviet branch (the BND) in occupied germany? Or all your nuh uhs and word games? I havent seen you post one single piece of documentation to support your denials...your ONLY support has been JUBAJI....that should tell you something....i have Supreme CT justices and pages of documentation to support my statement...you have a bunch of NUH uhs and jubaji....

[jubaji]

you were attempting to discredit me....:

You've discredited yourself over and over and over again. You really seem to like getting your ass kicked for some reason.

[BoarSpear]

And now the Gehlen organisation

Organization Gehlen

The Gehlen Organization is a post-war agency, and the predecessor of the BND (Bundesnachrichtendienst).

Major General Reinhard Gehlen headed the Foreign Armies East section of the Abwehr, directed towards the Soviet Union. Gehlen had begun planning his surrender to the United States at least as early as the fall of 1944. In early March 1945 a group of Gehlen's senior officers microfilmed their holdings on the USSR. They packed the film in steel drums and buried it throughout the Austrian Alps. On 22 May 1945 Gehlen and his top aides surrendered to an American Counter-intelligence Corps [CIC] team.

After the War, the United States recognized that it did not have an intelligence capability directed against the Soviet Union, a wartime ally. Gehlen negotiated an agreement with the United States which allowed his operation to continue in existence despite post-war de-nazification programs. The group, including his immediate staff of about 350 agents, was known as the Gehlen Organization. Reconstituted as a functioning espionage network under U.S. control, it became CIA's eyes and ears in Eastern Europe and in the Soviet Union.

Hundreds of German army and SS officers were released from internment camps to join Gehlen's headquarters in the Spessart Mountains in central Germany. When the staff grew to 3,000, the Bureau Gehlen moved to a twenty-five-acre compound near Pullach, south of Munich, operating under the innocent name of the South German Industrial Development Organization. In the early fifties it was estimated that the organization employed up to 4,000 intelligence specialists in Germany, mainly former army and SS officers, and that more than 4,000 V-men (undercover agents) were active throughout the Soviet-bloc countries.

http://www.fas.org/irp/world/germany/intro/gehlen.htm

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Gehlen, the Nazi, and the CIA



General Gehlen had been the Nazi head of intelligence in the Soviet Union. In May 1945, he surrendered, along with his archives, to the U.S. He was presented to Major-General Luther Sibert, head of intelligence for General Bradley's armies. At Sibert's request, Gehlen the Nazi wrote a 129-page report. Thereafter, Gehlen `developed his great scheme of a secret organisation engaged on intelligence work against the Soviet Union under American aegis.'

http://www.plp.org/books/Stalin/node142.html

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HMMMM id say Gehlen ran the Gehlen org which became the BND...the BND worked under american intelligence aegis......Looks like top nazis ran our intelligence agency tasked within dealing with soviet union...our biggest enemy at the time....huh Mike?.......

[BoarSpear]

Okay, lets see ....I PROVED THE BND/CIA and gehlin connection...now enjoy oddessa.....ODESSA
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
Jump to: navigation, search

See Odessa (disambiguation) for other uses of the word "Odessa".

ODESSA (German Organisation der ehemaligen SS-Angehörigen; "The Organization of Former SS-Members") was an alleged Nazi-German fugitive network set up towards the end of World War II by a group of SS officers, among whom were Martin Bormann and Heinrich Himmler. This group's purpose was to establish and facilitate a secret escape route out of Germany to South America and the Middle East for hunted members. With alleged ties to Argentina, Egypt, Germany, Italy, Switzerland, and the Vatican, ODESSA ostensibly operated out of Buenos Aires and helped Adolf Eichmann, Josef Mengele, Erich Priebke, Aribert Heim and many other war criminals find refuge in Latin America and the Middle East.

SS-Obersturmbannführer Otto Skorzeny and Sturmbannführer Alfred Naujocks were both believed to have been active in this organization, but these suppositions have never been proved. Similarly, General Reinhard Gehlen's entire intelligence organisation that was employed and protected by US intelligence within a few months of the end of the war (and which subsequently became an important part of NATO intelligence in eastern Europe), came under suspicion.

Breathing new life into the recurring speculations about ODESSA, a note purportedly coming from the organization claimed responsibility for the 9 July 1979 car bombing in France aimed at anti-Nazi activists Serge and Beate Klarsfeld.

In November 2005, Spanish newspaper El Mundo reported that Mauthausen concentration camp's Nazi doctor Aribert Heim, protected by ODESSA, had possibly been hiding in Spain for the past 20 years. According to sources from the Simon Wiesenthal Center quoted by El Mundo [1], former soldiers of Otto Skorzeny (who died in an accident in Madrid in 1975) had helped maintain the organization in Spain, especially in the region around Malaga and Alicante.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ODESSA

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Although the ink had barely dried on the Yalta agreements, which required the United States to give the Soviets any captured German officers who had been involved in "eastern area activities," Gehlen was soon transferred to Fort Hunt, Virginia. There, he dined with U.S. officials whose appetite for Cold War scuttlebutt was growing voracious. The flop-eared German general played their psyches like piano keys, with a seductive anti-Soviet pitch that left competing elements of the U.S. espionage establishment vying for his services.

During his 10 months at Fort Hunt, Gehlen presented a professional image, the pure technician who liked nothing better than to immerse himself in maps, flow-charts and statistics. The persona he projected was, in espionage parlance, a "legend" -- one that hinged on Gehlen's false claim that he was never really a Nazi. He just was dedicated to fighting communism. Among those who took the bait was future CIA director, Allen Dulles, who became one of Gehlen's biggest post-war boosters.

With a mandate to continue gathering information in the East just as he had been doing for Hitler, Gehlen re-established his spy organization, initially under U.S. Army supervision. The Gehlen "Org," as it was called, enlisted thousands of Gestapo, Wehrmacht and SS veterans despite Gehlen's promise to U.S. officials that he would not employ hard-core Nazis.

http://www.consortiumnews.com/archive/story41.html

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Categories: SS
ODESSA



ODESSA (German: Organisation der ehemaligen SS-Angehörigen; "The Organization of Former SS-Members") was an alleged Nazi fugitive network set up towards the end of World War II by a group of SS officers. With alleged ties to Germany, Switzerland, Italy and the Vatican, ODESSA allegedly operated out of Buenos Aires and helped Adolf Eichmann, Josef Mengele, Erich Priebke and many other war criminals find refuge in Latin America.

SS-Obersturmbannführer Otto Skorzeny was believed to have been active in this organization, but this supposition has never been proved. Similarly, General Reinhard Gehlen's entire intelligence organisation that was employed and protected by US Intelligence within a few months of the end of the war, has come under suspicion.

http://www.bigpedia.com/encyclopedia/ODESSA

[BoarSpear]

, I've recently discovered you're even using the boards themselves to ignore ALL statements made by people you don't want to hear from. You just block them out altogether! Afraid of more than one person pointing out how full of it your statements are?

BWAHAHAHA YES MR MODERATOR .... I AM USING THE SUPPLIED IGNORE FEATURE TO IGNORE ONE PERSON....JUBAJI....IS THAT YOUR BIG BACK UP? JUBAJI YES i HAVE HIM ON IGNORE....IF HE IS YOUR BACK UP, AGAIN, THAT OUGHT TO TELL YOU SOMETHING.

YOU HAVENT ADMITTED THE NAZI RUN BND THAT WAS A CIA FINANCED ORGANIZATION.
you still deny the pages of proof....all you wanna do deny evade and accuse...that proves you aint got shit except a hard head.

you can spin all the shit you want. i said top nazis ran our intell agencies...and i proved it...you just dont wanna admit it...gee i wonder why?

[BoarSpear]

http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/spages/536364.html

Last Update: 05/02/2005 19:57
Documents reveal CIA recruited five of Eichmann's associates
By Yossi Melman, Haaretz Correspondent

Five of Adolph Eichmann's Nazi assistants were recruited and employed by the Central Intelligence Agency after World War II, according to recently declassified intelligence documents.

The information came to light after a lengthy battle waged by the non-profit group, The National Security Archive, whose goal is to expose government documents under the framework of the Freedom of Information Act.

The newly-revealed documents are based on internal investigations in the CIA's history department. The agency has steadfastly refused to make the documents public for fear they would cause embarassment.

The revelations cast a negative light not only on American intelligence activity but also the U.S. Army's conduct in Germany at the conclusion of the war. The military made efforts to recruit members of the SS and the Gestapo into its ranks despite simultaenously waging a campaign of de-Nazification over vanquished Germany, a process which included arresting and trying Nazi war criminals.

The documents also reveal in great detail CIA efforts to recruit Reinhard Gehlen, who was the Wermacht's chief intelligence officer for the eastern front during the war.

The recruitment evolved into a new intelligence sub-organization known as "Gehlen's Organization," which served as the basis for what would later become West Germany's foreign intelligence service, the Bundesnachrichtendienst (BND).

According to the new findings, Gehlen's Organization employed a number of Gestapo and SS officials. Gehlen and his senior associates secretly operated out of a building with the knowledge of the American occupation forces.

http://newsmine.org/archive/cabal-elite/secret-society/cia/documents-reveal-cia-recruited-5-eichmann-associates.txt