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This thread is to clear up some bs about the boztepe/cheung fight. The article was too long so its on 2 posts.
The Germany Incident:
Ten years After
Written by Marty Goldberg
Interview by Russ Urquhart
10 years ago, what many consider to be the most degrading crime ever committed in martial arts history occurred in Cologne, Germany.
Grandmaster William Cheung, of Traditional Wing Chun, had been asked to take time out of his busy seminar schedule to give a special two day seminar in Germany. Always happy to accommodate people, Grandmaster
Cheung added the two days, unknowingly stepping in to a detailed plan set up by Leung Ting to defame him. The end result was an illegally distributed and highly edited video clip that wound up as an addition to Leung Ting's video tape Dynamic Wing Tsun, and did nothing more but to further hurt the image of Wing Chun Kung Fu.
This article, composed of interviews with the Grandmaster done over 1994-95, will explain for the fist time in the pages of IKF, Grandmaster Cheung's explanation of what went on that day in Cologne. Also for the
first time in print, a detailed account of Leung Ting's four stage plan for the Germany ambush that was recently exposed by another senior student of Grandmaster Yip Man's that resides in northern Europe.
----------
Background
----------
At the time of the Germany ambush, there was much turmoil going on within the Wing Chun family as to who had seniority, who was most qualified, etc. The general public was exposed to this through letters back and forth between many of the seniors and juniors, that appeared in this magazine as well as others.
GM Cheung: "Well, many many years prior (to the incident), Leung Ting and I were on speaking terms. But, I think it was just some misunderstanding or something. And also, the other...there was a lot of question and answer back and so on, on the magazines. Relating to who's seniority, and who's more qualified. So..you know, it never was in my mind that he would try something like (the Germany ambush)."
The missunerstanding in question is a result of two pieces of misinformation. One was an incorrect interpretation of one of Grandmaster Cheung's letters to state that he would "fight anyone, anywhere, anytime".
Those knowledgable in tradition, know that you can not challenge a senior.
One of the first things taught in any Kung Fu is that no members of the same family should fight amongst themselves, and secondly to respect your seniors.
The second misinterpretation was an incident that occurred in New York, several months before the Germany ambush. Leung Ting was giving a seminar in New York on his art Wing Tsun. Unknown to Grandmaster Cheung,
several of his students had chosen to attend this seminar. Leung Ting wanted a volunteer to help him demonstrate his superior reflexes. He chose one of GM Cheung's students, who happened to be wearing a World Wing Chun Kung Fu Association (the governing body of Traditional Wing Chun) t-shirt. The student managed to get through Leung Ting's guard and slap his face a couple of times. One of Leung Ting's bodyguards immediately jumped in, several other of GM Cheung's students jumped in to help, and a large confrontation occurred, until one of GM Cheung's students finally calmed the situation down. The event was not planned, and later upon hearing of the disturbance that occurred, GM Cheung severely reprimanded the students who had taken part.
--------------------------------
What Actually occurred in Germany
--------------------------------
GM Cheung: Several months later, somebody asked me to organize a seminar in Germany for Traditional Wing Chun.The person who asked it, doesn't practice Wing Chun, so he teamed up with a Wing Chun instructor that
had a school there. So they organized two days, Saturday and Sunday.
Russ: Now the seminar that they asked you, was this part of kind of what you're doing now, this was a set of seminars you were doing, and someone said we want one in Germany?
GM Cheung: Yah, yes.
Russ: Had you been to Germany before this?
GM Cheung: No.....yah, I've been there once before, but it was just on tour.
Russ: Did you have much of an organization or a lot of Traditional Wing Chun people in Germany at that time?
GM Cheung: No, not one single person. It was just someone that came out from the blue and said "Look, let's do a seminar in Cologne". Before I went to Germany, I was warned by a friend to keep out of trouble with the
law there because they dealt barbarically with foreigners, putting them in jail for months without even questioning them if they broke the law. This was a fact that stuck in my mind. Also, as I was only in Germany to do one seminar, I did not obtain a work permit, so I knew if this was discovered I would be in a lot of trouble and probably be detained there for a long time.
On Saturday, the seminar began at 11am, and the organizer, Augustine Yiu was late to pick me up. By the time I arrived at the university basketball stadium (gym) where the seminar was to take place, the participants were already inside. We were approached by two people, a photographer and a journalist, from a German martial arts magazine who said they wanted to interview me during the break. They wanted some photos straight away and asked me to change in to my Kung Fu suit and slippers.
I complied and they took some photos of me in various poses. Because things were running very late, I didn't have time to change back to my normal track shoes and outfit.
It was time for the seminar to start and there were almost a 100 people there. So I started with some warm-ups, light warm-ups, Wing Chun punching, and coordination drills. So after about fifteen or twenty
minutes, I sort of went around to check everybody's movements. So, one chap came up with a couple of other guys walking behind him. One of them introduced himself as Emin Boztepe, a student of Keith Kernspecht. He
was holding an issue of Combat Magazine in his hand that contained a copy of an open letter which I had written to Lok Yiu, Leung Shung, Tsui Shun Tin, and Wong Shun Leung some time ago. He wanted to ask some questions about what I had previously said in the article. So I said, "Look, you just
read it, it's very clear". He said, "No, no, no, I want to challenge you."
I said although he did not have the seniority, by all means I would humour him after the seminar. But let's please do it after. And then I just walked away and didn't take much notice.
When I started the second sort of technique drill, he came over again, and I noticed there's about 10-15 people walking behind and around him. And as soon as he came up, they went and formed a circle around us. And he said, "I want to fight you now." And I said, "Well, that's different. You said you wanted to spar and now you want to fight." I said, "Let's do it after class." And he began mumbling something, and I said, "Look, you know, I
granted you the fight after the class. And strictly speaking, you're not even in my seniority." So I walked away, but I knew he more or less was going to try something. So after I walked away, the third step he rushed in and threw a round punch with his right arm.
Russ: What did you think when this happened? Had you ever been in a situation like this where you're teaching and someone had done this to you before?
GM Cheung: No. In the exact same terms, when I first came to New York (in 1983), in the seminar, they always want to test this and test that.
I always give them a chace. But this one, I knew it was different because he had a whole group of people. When the second time he came up, there's another 14-15 people with this time I noticed. So when I started
to walk away, the circle had been formed. They sort of put their arm up, so that the other students could not get close. I had a German interpreter standing next to me, and as it happened, someone put him in a headlock and pulled him back behind the circle. And I knew it wasn't one person at that moment, though I didn't know what the numbers were. So, you know, he just jumped in and threw the punch and then I swung around and shot out a Bil Sao (thrusting arm), which stopped his sucker punch. At the same time, I front kicked him. It was always in the back of my mind, if I hurt somebody it will involve the law and it will be so complicated.
So I more or less kicked just to push him away. But because I was wearing the Kung Fu slippers, and the floor was polished timber and very slippery, I slid away on impact. That was the other thing in my mind, that is why I wanted to do it after the class (besides the reason that it was not proper to interrupt other people's time that they are paying good money for), that way I could change my shoes. Boztepe rushed in again throwing punches furiously, so I sidestepped. I did the Jut Sao (jerking arm) and Huen Sao (rotating wrist) to diffuse his punches. Then I used Pak Sao (push block) to control his elbow. Because the floor was so slippery, I wound up behind him. So I put him in a headlock, because my intention was only to restrain him, not to fight him. Then I thought for a moment I was going to...you know, might as well poke him in the eye and finish it right there. He was struggling like a wounded mule because he had no countering technique against the headlock. Because of the slipperiness of the floor and my shoes, I was sliding around like I was on roller skates. At that time, I started slipping, and then he fell as well. He was more or less lying on top of me. Then he was sitting on my stomach, and tried to throw a few punches which I blocked with Bil Sao's to the elbow. Then I arched my body so he was trying to balance more or less, and then I kneed him a couple of times. After that, somebody called out, Boztepe got up and ran away. And as I got up, then I saw at least 20 people run out from the gym. Somebody said that they had video cameras and regular cameras.
The Germany Incident:
Ten years After
Written by Marty Goldberg
Interview by Russ Urquhart
10 years ago, what many consider to be the most degrading crime ever committed in martial arts history occurred in Cologne, Germany.
Grandmaster William Cheung, of Traditional Wing Chun, had been asked to take time out of his busy seminar schedule to give a special two day seminar in Germany. Always happy to accommodate people, Grandmaster
Cheung added the two days, unknowingly stepping in to a detailed plan set up by Leung Ting to defame him. The end result was an illegally distributed and highly edited video clip that wound up as an addition to Leung Ting's video tape Dynamic Wing Tsun, and did nothing more but to further hurt the image of Wing Chun Kung Fu.
This article, composed of interviews with the Grandmaster done over 1994-95, will explain for the fist time in the pages of IKF, Grandmaster Cheung's explanation of what went on that day in Cologne. Also for the
first time in print, a detailed account of Leung Ting's four stage plan for the Germany ambush that was recently exposed by another senior student of Grandmaster Yip Man's that resides in northern Europe.
----------
Background
----------
At the time of the Germany ambush, there was much turmoil going on within the Wing Chun family as to who had seniority, who was most qualified, etc. The general public was exposed to this through letters back and forth between many of the seniors and juniors, that appeared in this magazine as well as others.
GM Cheung: "Well, many many years prior (to the incident), Leung Ting and I were on speaking terms. But, I think it was just some misunderstanding or something. And also, the other...there was a lot of question and answer back and so on, on the magazines. Relating to who's seniority, and who's more qualified. So..you know, it never was in my mind that he would try something like (the Germany ambush)."
The missunerstanding in question is a result of two pieces of misinformation. One was an incorrect interpretation of one of Grandmaster Cheung's letters to state that he would "fight anyone, anywhere, anytime".
Those knowledgable in tradition, know that you can not challenge a senior.
One of the first things taught in any Kung Fu is that no members of the same family should fight amongst themselves, and secondly to respect your seniors.
The second misinterpretation was an incident that occurred in New York, several months before the Germany ambush. Leung Ting was giving a seminar in New York on his art Wing Tsun. Unknown to Grandmaster Cheung,
several of his students had chosen to attend this seminar. Leung Ting wanted a volunteer to help him demonstrate his superior reflexes. He chose one of GM Cheung's students, who happened to be wearing a World Wing Chun Kung Fu Association (the governing body of Traditional Wing Chun) t-shirt. The student managed to get through Leung Ting's guard and slap his face a couple of times. One of Leung Ting's bodyguards immediately jumped in, several other of GM Cheung's students jumped in to help, and a large confrontation occurred, until one of GM Cheung's students finally calmed the situation down. The event was not planned, and later upon hearing of the disturbance that occurred, GM Cheung severely reprimanded the students who had taken part.
--------------------------------
What Actually occurred in Germany
--------------------------------
GM Cheung: Several months later, somebody asked me to organize a seminar in Germany for Traditional Wing Chun.The person who asked it, doesn't practice Wing Chun, so he teamed up with a Wing Chun instructor that
had a school there. So they organized two days, Saturday and Sunday.
Russ: Now the seminar that they asked you, was this part of kind of what you're doing now, this was a set of seminars you were doing, and someone said we want one in Germany?
GM Cheung: Yah, yes.
Russ: Had you been to Germany before this?
GM Cheung: No.....yah, I've been there once before, but it was just on tour.
Russ: Did you have much of an organization or a lot of Traditional Wing Chun people in Germany at that time?
GM Cheung: No, not one single person. It was just someone that came out from the blue and said "Look, let's do a seminar in Cologne". Before I went to Germany, I was warned by a friend to keep out of trouble with the
law there because they dealt barbarically with foreigners, putting them in jail for months without even questioning them if they broke the law. This was a fact that stuck in my mind. Also, as I was only in Germany to do one seminar, I did not obtain a work permit, so I knew if this was discovered I would be in a lot of trouble and probably be detained there for a long time.
On Saturday, the seminar began at 11am, and the organizer, Augustine Yiu was late to pick me up. By the time I arrived at the university basketball stadium (gym) where the seminar was to take place, the participants were already inside. We were approached by two people, a photographer and a journalist, from a German martial arts magazine who said they wanted to interview me during the break. They wanted some photos straight away and asked me to change in to my Kung Fu suit and slippers.
I complied and they took some photos of me in various poses. Because things were running very late, I didn't have time to change back to my normal track shoes and outfit.
It was time for the seminar to start and there were almost a 100 people there. So I started with some warm-ups, light warm-ups, Wing Chun punching, and coordination drills. So after about fifteen or twenty
minutes, I sort of went around to check everybody's movements. So, one chap came up with a couple of other guys walking behind him. One of them introduced himself as Emin Boztepe, a student of Keith Kernspecht. He
was holding an issue of Combat Magazine in his hand that contained a copy of an open letter which I had written to Lok Yiu, Leung Shung, Tsui Shun Tin, and Wong Shun Leung some time ago. He wanted to ask some questions about what I had previously said in the article. So I said, "Look, you just
read it, it's very clear". He said, "No, no, no, I want to challenge you."
I said although he did not have the seniority, by all means I would humour him after the seminar. But let's please do it after. And then I just walked away and didn't take much notice.
When I started the second sort of technique drill, he came over again, and I noticed there's about 10-15 people walking behind and around him. And as soon as he came up, they went and formed a circle around us. And he said, "I want to fight you now." And I said, "Well, that's different. You said you wanted to spar and now you want to fight." I said, "Let's do it after class." And he began mumbling something, and I said, "Look, you know, I
granted you the fight after the class. And strictly speaking, you're not even in my seniority." So I walked away, but I knew he more or less was going to try something. So after I walked away, the third step he rushed in and threw a round punch with his right arm.
Russ: What did you think when this happened? Had you ever been in a situation like this where you're teaching and someone had done this to you before?
GM Cheung: No. In the exact same terms, when I first came to New York (in 1983), in the seminar, they always want to test this and test that.
I always give them a chace. But this one, I knew it was different because he had a whole group of people. When the second time he came up, there's another 14-15 people with this time I noticed. So when I started
to walk away, the circle had been formed. They sort of put their arm up, so that the other students could not get close. I had a German interpreter standing next to me, and as it happened, someone put him in a headlock and pulled him back behind the circle. And I knew it wasn't one person at that moment, though I didn't know what the numbers were. So, you know, he just jumped in and threw the punch and then I swung around and shot out a Bil Sao (thrusting arm), which stopped his sucker punch. At the same time, I front kicked him. It was always in the back of my mind, if I hurt somebody it will involve the law and it will be so complicated.
So I more or less kicked just to push him away. But because I was wearing the Kung Fu slippers, and the floor was polished timber and very slippery, I slid away on impact. That was the other thing in my mind, that is why I wanted to do it after the class (besides the reason that it was not proper to interrupt other people's time that they are paying good money for), that way I could change my shoes. Boztepe rushed in again throwing punches furiously, so I sidestepped. I did the Jut Sao (jerking arm) and Huen Sao (rotating wrist) to diffuse his punches. Then I used Pak Sao (push block) to control his elbow. Because the floor was so slippery, I wound up behind him. So I put him in a headlock, because my intention was only to restrain him, not to fight him. Then I thought for a moment I was going to...you know, might as well poke him in the eye and finish it right there. He was struggling like a wounded mule because he had no countering technique against the headlock. Because of the slipperiness of the floor and my shoes, I was sliding around like I was on roller skates. At that time, I started slipping, and then he fell as well. He was more or less lying on top of me. Then he was sitting on my stomach, and tried to throw a few punches which I blocked with Bil Sao's to the elbow. Then I arched my body so he was trying to balance more or less, and then I kneed him a couple of times. After that, somebody called out, Boztepe got up and ran away. And as I got up, then I saw at least 20 people run out from the gym. Somebody said that they had video cameras and regular cameras.
It's like saying that WC is better than all other styles. 
I am definately missing something ..... did Boztepe challgene one of the Gracies. If so it should be bareknuckle, when was the challenge made and what (if any) was the Gracies response. Are they taking this serious
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