Technique discussions, pictures and video etc.

[JadeDragon]

The mere fact that he believes it doesn't make it true, or useful. And if he is an instructor, as he claims, and is teaching this is a defense against the RNC then someone might get injured because it doesn't work as advertised.

I agree that I don't think it will work. But if someone does a technique (that works for everyone else) and it doesn't work for them can you blame the instructor for this and say he shouldn't teach it?

[TigerClaw]

Not really... a serious picture would involve somebody who truly knows how to apply a RNC, standing or grounded.

I know exactly how to do a rear naked choke. If I post pictures of it will you repent and go back to the Dragon list and get out of here. I don't want to bother with men like you and all your assumptions and attacks. Just go away.

[Kintanon]

You are wrong again.

By the way what techniques do you have for a person that has just locked in and has not yet started to squeeze tight?

Do you have any?

If not then you have noting to offer here.

I know there are so many different defenses a person can do, just before the lock comes. But what if they already have their arms around the neck?

Nothing?

There are other escapes as well as this one. But this one is good. I know that even this techniques would work best just before the person gets his arms around and locked. Also surprise is a key element here. and distraction.

If they have their arms around your neck then the lock is on. Period. Whether they are squeezing the elbows together, pushing the chest out and FINISHING the lock you are still locked in, tight. Your BEST BET is to try to get some fingers in and make a little space as I described previously. But you NOTHING you do at that point is going to be high percentage. EVERY escape you try from there is going to be a low percentage desperation escape and you only have 5 seconds to make it work.
Your escape is not high percentage.

[TigerClaw]

I agree that I don't think it will work. But if someone does a technique (that works for everyone else) and it doesn't work for them can you blame the instructor for this and say he shouldn't teach it?

Every technique I show will work, if practiced and done at the right time and way.

i also showed some MMA guys doing a similar technique earlier. I am not alone in the understanding of the technique I show.

YouTube - MMA Stand-Up Fighting for Self Defense : How to Escape a Standing Choke Hold

And I think we can agree that every technique can be defended against and countered and countered etc etc. And that there is weaknesses and openings etc to every technique.

[TigerClaw]

If they have their arms around your neck then the lock is on. Period. Whether they are squeezing the elbows together, pushing the chest out and FINISHING the lock you are still locked in, tight. Your BEST BET is to try to get some fingers in and make a little space as I described previously. But you NOTHING you do at that point is going to be high percentage. EVERY escape you try from there is going to be a low percentage desperation escape and you only have 5 seconds to make it work.
Your escape is not high percentage.

I don't agree fully. It depends on how you do the technique and the distraction measures you use to weaken the lock.

But are you basically saying that you don't have an answer or a technique to escape this once it is locked?

[DaleDugas]

Bruce,

Can I come cross hands to see if you are truly as skillful as you claim or are you going to be ignore me, as you usually do, and hide like a coward.

You claim much, and refuse to step up and only want to talk and post photos rather than meet people and actually train.

Bruce,

People are asking you questions, and a polite person would answer.

[Uncle Skippy]

And I think we can agree that every technique can be defended against and countered and countered etc etc. And that there is weaknesses and openings etc to every technique.

Your problem is that you fail to believe there is a 'point of no return' after which, no matter what you do, you can't escape from it.

One thing that would help to bring some clarity to the discussion and put you on solid ground Bruce is to answer the following question:

How long have you trained with Brian Leishman and Sterling Lin?

Otherwise, it is assumed you don't know anything, have only trained in your garage, and have no practical Kung Fu experience.

[Kintanon]

I agree that I don't think it will work. But if someone does a technique (that works for everyone else) and it doesn't work for them can you blame the instructor for this and say he shouldn't teach it?

That's just it, his technique DOES NOT work for everyone else, it doesn't work reliably against a competent opponent for anyone. It's low percentage and it appears to be the only escape he has because he hasn't mentioned any others. I have no fewer than 5 stages of RNC escape. I've already described them on this thread.
Mr. TigerKlaw is wedded to this technique, he sees it as some kind of panacea against the dreaded sport fighter and refuses to realize that it is not reliable. No one is saying that the RNC is inescapable, but just like almost every other technique there is a point of no return after which escape becomes almost impossible. Your PRIMARY training focus should be on the parts of the attacking leading up to that point.
As I said, as a desperation attempt to escape when all else has failed then his technique is as good as anything else, but it should not be relied upon as a high percentage primary escape.

[Uncle Skippy]

Bruce,

You would realize that the 'point of no return' exists if you had practical experience in Brazilian Jiu Jitsu or another grappling/wrestling art.

Your escape is perfectly legal in Sport MMA competitions yet we don't see anyone doing it. Why? It isn't a novel escape. If it worked, it would be seen all over the place.

But it isn't.

In your opinion, why not?

[USArmyBJJ]

Bruce,

Can I come cross hands to see if you are truly as skillful as you claim or are you going to be ignore me, as you usually do, and hide like a coward.

You claim much, and refuse to step up and only want to talk and post photos rather than meet people and actually train.

Bruce,

People are asking you questions, and a polite person would answer.

Should he have to fight anyone that disagrees with him on the internet??? If not, why should you be special? I'm not tyring to be rude - but it seems like an unreasonable request that wouldn't really prove much either way.

[clfsean]

I know exactly how to do a rear naked choke. If I post pictures of it will you repent and go back to the Dragon list and get out of here. I don't want to bother with men like you and all your assumptions and attacks. Just go away.

I'm not interested in your attempts at a RNC. I want to see somebody who knows how to properly apply it & you escape from it. That's the issue on the table here Monty... That's what you said you can do.

Repent? Repent what? Calling BS to almost everything out of your mouth? Pfah... better chance of me being hit by a metorite on my drive home.

[DaleDugas]

Should he have to fight anyone that disagrees with him on the internet??? If not, why should you be special? I'm not tyring to be rude - but it seems like an unreasonable request that wouldn't really prove much either way.

He claims to be a Traditional Kung Fu Teacher. That means he should have an open door and welcome people in to test out his skills. Why the hiding like a coward?

This is not about fighting to the death. It is about trying out all that he claims against another trained Kung Fu teacher.

He claims much and goes on and on and on about how he has the skills
yet only shows forms and apps against the child who we assume is his son.

That and all his posturing and hiding behind the internet is ridiculous.

He says he has students and a school yet will not let anyone know where, as that is too dangerous. I really have no clue as to why anyone would say this unless they are operating something illegally or they have a cult going.

If you have a school advertise it and be proud of it. He does the exact opposite.

If it is too dangerous than maybe Bruce should never have opened his mouth and claimed much and backed up none.

We need people like him the MA community like people need tentacles on their face. (Sorry all you Cthullu lovers out there....)

[USArmyBJJ]

But he claims much and goes on and on and on about how he has the skills
yet only shows forms and apps against the child who we assume is his son.

That and all his posturing and hiding behind the internet is ridiculous.

What would you actually prove if you fought, though? At most you'd prove that one fighter is better and/or luckier than the other. Only if the experiment is repeated several times with controls would it really prove anything.

I mean, I think he's largely deluded as well. But, so what? It's the internet! That's just the way it works

[Uncle Skippy]

What would you actually prove if you fought, though? At most you'd prove that one fighter is better and/or luckier than the other. Only if the experiment is repeated several times with controls would it really prove anything.

I mean, I think he's largely deluded as well. But, so what? It's the internet! That's just the way it works

There is background with Bruce Downey (aka TigerClaw) disrespecting others, claiming superiority, and spitting on the traditions and practitioners of Kung Fu.

He is he kind of guy who depends on the weak minded to accept his bait hook, line, and sinker. In short, an attention whore.

On the other forum (from which this thread is a spillover), he would not answer any direct questions and passive-aggressively insulted others every chance he got.

For me, it is amusing to just continually show others how full of himself he is. Wait.. how full he is of himself. full how he is himself of.

Damnit.

How arrogant and narcissistic he is.

These are the internetz. It is serious bizness :-)

[TigerClaw]

That's just it, his technique DOES NOT work for everyone else, it doesn't work reliably against a competent opponent for anyone. It's low percentage and it appears to be the only escape he has because he hasn't mentioned any others. I have no fewer than 5 stages of RNC escape. I've already described them on this thread.
Mr. TigerKlaw is wedded to this technique, he sees it as some kind of panacea against the dreaded sport fighter and refuses to realize that it is not reliable. No one is saying that the RNC is inescapable, but just like almost every other technique there is a point of no return after which escape becomes almost impossible. Your PRIMARY training focus should be on the parts of the attacking leading up to that point.
As I said, as a desperation attempt to escape when all else has failed then his technique is as good as anything else, but it should not be relied upon as a high percentage primary escape.

We can agree that no matter what the technique there is always a counter, in almost every case I would say.

But the key to this one is the attackers arm and your body twisting. It is about leverage and the element of surprise. The arm of the attacker around the back of the head is the weak link.

anyway there are other RNC escapes also that work good.