Abir Warrior Arts

[LuohanFist]

Well, is it too far fetched to say that perhaps said people actually trained with said weapons before marching off to battle? Considering the success of their campaigns I would have to say they were pretty well trained in something.

Martial

arts

techniques

are

not

mentioned

ANYWHERE

in

the

old

testament

or

old

Jewish

records

[TTEscrima]

1. I don't sell anything.
2. I don't have any Dr. Painter products on my page.

Dale Dugas IS a John Painter product as are all the formula's and pills on the page. You know the page where you recommend products to people?

[LuohanFist]

Dale Dugas IS a John Painter product as are all the formula's and pills on the page. You know the page where you recommend products to people?

Again, do you have something I need to know?

A moment ago you were accusing me of selling a product which I do not, now you are accusing me of lying I take it?

As I said before, I am commenting on something that's related to my field of knowlege. If you have something, share it. If you have a point to make, make it. Do you think I am hiding something?

[mellow]

Martial

arts

techniques

are

not

mentioned

ANYWHERE

in

the

old

testament

or

old

Jewish

records

Perhaps it's an oral tradition? Could be that the techniques weren't catalogued and recorded in the way they were in Asia.

[TTEscrima]

Again, do you have something I need to know?

A moment ago you were accusing me of selling a product, now you are accusing me of lying I take it?

As I said before, I am commenting on something that's related to my field of knowlege. If you have something, share it. If you have a point to make, make it. Do you think I am hiding something?

Do you know who taught Dale to make those pills you recommend? Dr John Painter.

Do you know whats in them? Tell me about the Hit pills you take before fighting, I see you recommend those so I assume you take them...whats in them?

I'd refer you to the threads about Painters lineage here but they seem to have all vanished.

The Great Invigorator: Bruise Pills
Manufacturer: CDIA, Shifu Dale Dugas

MedicineShen Tong Zhu Yu Wan

This classical Chinese Herbal formula was designed to help move blood, decrease pain as well as help deal with a variety of physical issues.

The Great Invigorator/Shen Tong Zhu Yu can assist with arthritic pain that presents with symptoms of fixed aches and pains that are worse with pressure and tend to be worse during the night, and can include shoulder, arm, low back, leg, foot or hand pain; chronic headaches, irregular menses, menstrual pain and post-partum lower abdominal pain.

This formula can help mitigate problems such as: joint pain, pain in the arms and legs, osteoarthritis, rheumatoid arthritis, rheumatism, bursitis, tendonitis, rotator cuff injury, carpal tunnel syndrome, repetitive motion syndrome, traumatic injury, dysmenorrhea.

The Great Invigorator can be used for acute or chronic traumatic injury.

This formula is designed to be utilized for only a few days, usually 2-3 days maximum.

[mellow]

Perhaps it's an oral tradition? Could be that the techniques weren't catalogued and recorded in the way they were in Asia.

He claims that his father taught him. Can you dispute that?
Not to say he's not totally full of it, but why are you picking him for your crusade against bad martial arts?

[LuohanFist]

Do you know who taught Dale to make those pills you recommend? Dr John Painter.

I thought as much, but again, no idea. If you want to invite Dale to this thread and ask, be my guest.

Do you know whats in them?

I will admit, for the first part, no clue.

I am however, planning to begin Chinese herbology courses within the next year. Unrelated, I know.

Tell me about the Hit pills you take before fighting, I see you recommend those so I assume you take them...whats in them?

Hit pills?

No idea as to the content. Don't think I take hit pills.
I did order a wine tonic which came in herb form. Is that the one you are talking about?

To be honest haven't tried the wine yet, as it's still brewing. Will post here know how it goes.

I'd refer you to the threads about Painters lineage here but they seem to have all vanished.

I'll google that myself, thanks.

With that aside,
1. Feel free to invite Dale to this thread and ask him.
2. Are you telling me you have no problem with the Abir video?
3. Are you telling me I am wrong about Jewish scripture not mentioning secret tribal martial arts?

[TTEscrima]

I
Hit pills?

Yes, Hit pills, or as they're being called on your site Bruise pills.

No comment on the video of Dales teacher moving people with his intent eh?

[LuohanFist]

He claims that his father taught him. Can you dispute that?
Not to say he's not totally full of it, but why are you picking him for your crusade against bad martial arts?

What crusade?
From what I read, he got secret techniques from the scriptures.
Is this information wrong? If it is, nevermind.
If it's not, I maintain my point.

Generally, however, I do have an issue with bullshit MA.

[LuohanFist]

Yes, Hit pills, or as they're being called on your site Bruise pills.

No, those I have not tried.
I concede to your point.

No comment on the video of Dales teacher moving people with his intent eh?

I have not seen this video. Can you link?

[LuohanFist]

http://www.defend.net/deluxeforums/chinese-martial-arts/34390-abir-warrior-arts.html#post331351

There is mention of it here, in this exherpt.
Will be back in a few hours to continue discussion.

[kingoftheforest]

What crusade?
From what I read, he got secret techniques from the scriptures.
Is this information wrong? If it is, nevermind.
If it's not, I maintain my point.

Generally, however, I do have an issue with bullshit MA.

Did you research this guy past an internet forum post and one video.

Or are you making assumptions just from that small amount of info?

I know it seems like the three of us are dog piling you, but that is not our intention.

Just make sure your opinions and comments are based on actual information about a said person/subject.

The other 2 people, TTE and mellow, as well as myself, research something thoroughly before we spout off.

Thanks.

[TTEscrima]

No, those I have not tried.
I concede to your point.


I have not seen this video. Can you link?

Sure for the second time in the thread as a reply to you.

YouTube - Using intent in Jiulong Baguazhang

[mellow]

http://www.defend.net/deluxeforums/c...tml#post331351

There is mention of it here, in this exherpt.
Will be back in a few hours to continue discussion.

That links back to this forum. I did try to read a little deeper and I didn't find anywhere it said the martial art came from the Torah.

He did admit, however, that Abir is a modern construction of his making based off of tribal traditions that he studied along with what he was taught from his father. I'm sure the KSW and Tukong Mu Sul played a large part in what he teaches now as well.

[LuohanFist]

Did you research this guy past an internet forum post and one video.

Or are you making assumptions just from that small amount of info?

I know it seems like the three of us are dog piling you, but that is not our intention.

No no, point well taken.
I admit my reaction was based on a quote that was along the lines of techniques coming from old testament.

I've skimmed his site now, for a better understanding of what the guy is presenting. My fault for not doing this eariler, I should have read the site more in-depth, I was wrong.

Abir&#0174 Warrior Arts

The guy has 7th degree black belt in Kuk Sul Won, Hapkido, and a 7th degree in TukGong Musool.

Abir&#0174 Warrior Arts

Yehoshua Sofer is the official representative of the Korea Kuksool Association, The World KIDO Federation and the newly formed HanMinJok Hapkido Association approved as the governing body for Korea's traditional martial arts by the S. Korean Ministry Of Culture in Israel and on the European continent.

However, there are some eyebrow raisers, but that's just my opinion. According to his bio, he started training at the age of 3.

He has several world leaders' personal protection/security personnel under his instruction and guidance from the President of Moldova to the Prime-Minister of Israel. He often oversees high profile events from behind the scenes.

Abir&#0174 Warrior Arts

The Grandmaster has developed his system of (RSD) Tactics which has been tested in combat by elite units of the IDF and in assisting some other countries who have approached Israel for help.
RSD is a trimmed down simplified version of Abir® for elite security/military /police personnel. RSD is NOT for the public!

Still, I find this claim dubious.

Other nations that do have such accounts and documentation do not lay claim to them for the simple fact they as a nation with a definitive language or presence have long been extinct.

There is however one exception to this rule. It is the People of Israel. Our ancestors provided us with great resources and authoritative eye witness documentation to confirm our contributions to the world in a multitude of realms including martial arts. Many scholars have confirmed this.

Bits and pieces of Abir® warrior arts were preserved to a greater degree by the more exotic and distant Israelite communities. Hasidic dances of Ukrainian Jews as well as similar steps and maneuvers by their brothers in Yemen and Kurdish mountain Jews testify to a common warlike sequence and configuration with swirling circular motions of the hands, torso and legs while negotiating backwards or forwards and the mimicry of stick, spear or sword swipes. To unknowing eyes and often to the dancers themselves the Abir® elements are not perceived or acknowledged.

Much of the bulk of what was left intact was kept alive by a group of nomadic Jews who roamed the Hejaz desert. Twelve Tribes dance steps and the form and shapes of the Hebrew letters contained deadly martial applications forgotten by virtually the rest of the world's Jewry. Although kept in the shadows Abir® survived by the grace of The Almighty.

This delves into anthropology, which is out of my league. While it's still very dubious IMO (the history part to be sure,) he pretty much states he created a modern system, with influence from folk dances.

With that, I can't find an issue.

Just make sure your opinions and comments are based on actual information about a said person/subject.

The other 2 people, TTE and mellow, as well as myself, research something thoroughly before we spout off.

Thanks.

Again, point well taken.

I am not a sophist, and will admit when I am wrong.
I should have done more digging before formulating an opinion.

I will now be your gimp for a week.