Bruce Lee and his skill - statements by various people

[Ghost]

THe smash refers to his left uppercut/left hook.
Which he loads well and is famous for.
He uses the body mechanics i described of in and out fast.
Nothing to do with pushing or leaving the punch there. The way to make a knock out is fast in and fast out with deep penetration or going straight through the target in the case of a circular punch where there is no chance of rebound onto the glove as the glove has gone past.

[Liberty]

They're both effective. By the way, that was the wrong clip -that one featured what you've described. Surprised you didn't cathch that.

My apologies. Here is the science behind the punch result Lee is training for on that bag, explained by some one who knows. It has a full commitment to it as is more a more thrust. Thanks for the feedback.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-258876367374143010

[Ghost]

yeah i know the science but hes not doing it the best way.
TO make a knock out you want to rattle the brain in the skull.

How would you shake a pea in a can? shake the can in and out fast? or throw it one way and leave it there then bring it back.
The correct way to make a knockout is to put the punch in AND out fast. to allow maximum recoil and rock the brain to the back AND front.

[Liberty]

yeah his punch bag work out leaves alot to be desired.

Actually, I meant the opposite. He was training his punch, in the clip, as a finishing off blow, one punch knockout. This went hand in hand with his set-ups. It is this stuff about him I'm mostly fascinated by.

Here's the science:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MY1V21ocDgc

[Ghost]

yeah his punch bag work out leaves alot to be desired.

[Liberty]

Its easier to knock someone out with gloves on that without, much easier.

Just as "pushing" one's fist into a heavy bag during training is the mark of a rookie:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BluUhcEvPtI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7xXWj4X2HU

[Ghost]

Its easier to knock someone out with gloves on that without, much easier.

[Liberty]

Rolf Clausnitzer, author of what is arguably the first ever English language book written & published on Wing Chun.

"As far as my interest in self defence was concerned, I had previously done a year of Judo under a very impressive Filipino instructor. I had also done a little bit of boxing at school and privately with an American friend….Then came the mind blowing experience which was to confirm my interest in Wing Chun...

One of his (Lee at 17, prior to leaving Hon Kong) favourite stunts was to stand on one leg and with the other fend off a number of "attackers", pivoting as required. His speed, balance, manoeuvrability, and control were such that it was almost impossible to close in on him without getting kicked….

Bruce invited me to "spar" with him, assuring me that I wouldn't get hurt...
He asked me to bring my arms in contact with his, turned his head through 180% so that he couldn't see me, and he gave me the go ahead to box, to go for his face and chest. I tried for what seemed like a minute to score, but he deflected and trapped every jab, hook, cross and uppercut I threw, and his fist kept ending up under my nose. I realise now that what he was doing to me was "blindfolded" Chi Sau of a very high order. From that moment on, I guess I was hooked.

Not long after, I was privileged to see Bruce again, not face to face, but in action at the Hong Kong Inter School Boxing Championships. Ironically, his opponent just happened to be good old Gary Elms, one of my schoolmates...

His bout with Bruce turned out to be the most amazing and bizarre boxing match I have ever seen and expect to see. I honestly believe that Gary did not land even one single scoring punch throughout the entire 3 x 1 minute rounds, with Bruce deflecting and taking all of Gary's punches on his arms.

Gary was knocked down several times, but he was not knocked out (contrary to what has been reported in various articles and books!) and, even more surprisingly, he did not appear to be hurt or distressed. Each time he was floored, he would immediately jump back up. That's why the referee did not stop the fight.

Notwithstanding Gary's extraordinary toughness, I was amazed to see him survive the bout in such good shape. It was not until later when I caught up with Frank that some sort of explanation emerged.

Apparently, when Frank and his friends went to congratulate Bruce after the bout, Bruce was shaking his head and looking far from pleased with himself. His reply to Frank's obvious question was something along the lines of, "Damn it, I couldn't knock the guy out". His rationalisation was that the large (16oz?) gloves neutralised the intended, penetrating effect of tilting the wrist on impact, a practice common to many Wing Chun practitioners (I gather he abandoned this practice in later years).

He reckoned that this force was not penetrating the padding and, in any case, Gary was already being propelled backwards from the pushing impact of the glove. He swore that he would continue training until he could achieve the penetration he wanted.

He also had his sights set on Peter Burton, a stylish and hard punching boxer from St George's School (which was exclusively for the children of British Armed Forces personnel in Hong Kong), a much bigger and heavier competitor who had TKO'd his opponent in the second round.

By the way, Frank and I met Peter (who turned out to be half German as well) at a party a few weeks later and we talked about Bruce, but it's unlikely that such a bout would ever have been approved because of the weight and size differences and, in any case, Bruce left for the USA a few months later to begin a new chapter in his amazing life..."

http://www.wingchun.com/ROLF.htm

About one year later:

Early Lee Student -James DeMile: ...I was a heavyweight boxer in the Air Force. Over a four year period I had over a hundred fights and never lost one. I had a very big ego and perceived myself as the toughtest man alive. I was 5ft 10inches and weighted 225. I could knock a man out with either hand. Then I met a small 135 lb 5 ft 7 kid who believed his martial arts could beat anyone. I decided to explain the reality of fighting to him and proceded to show him what street fighting was all about. Needless to say I learned humility in about 5 seconds. He not only stopped me cold, but tied me up in such a way that he could hit me at will and the only thing I could do about it was... nothing. Later I reviewed all my previous skills, including boxing and threw all of it out as it was impractical against Bruce's skills.
...Most of the questions about Bruces fighting skills are asked by people who did not know him. Most of the answers are from people who either did not know him or related their answer how Bruce would have done in a tournament. Joe Lewis is very out front with his comments and yet he always compares Bruce to either his tournament days or some world champion. I really enjoy meeting these people and always look forward to giving my opinion on why Bruce was the best street fighter I ever knew. Not pound for pound, but against anyone in a street fight. I was never in a tournament and had many street fights and I have never seen anyone that I would have been scared to fight, regardless of their Belts and trophies. This goes for UFC and K1. I'm not saying I could beat all of them, I am just saying they are tough, but so what. People do not understand what Bruce did in a real fight. They relate his skills to the movies or JKD. No, that was martial arts. Fighting is survival. It is mean, ugly and stupid and someone can reall be hurt or killed. Bruce knew he could be hurt if he got hit, that is why he believed a street fight should not last over two seconds and his personal skills were designed for that attitde. I am very opinionated and willing to discuss with anyone my belief in why Bruce was the best fighter I ever knew. And I still feel that way, 42 years later.

http://www.cityonfire.com/unknown/interviews/demile/index.htm

[g-bells]

I have been reading martial art forums for a while now, and I don't pretend to know much more than anyone else who reads Black Belt.
Questions: is jkd the same as mma? Or is it mma but out of an unorthodox stance? If jkd is not the same as mma, then how is it different or better?
Sorry if these seem like naive questions, but this issue is pressing on my mind alot more than if Bruce got beat-up by some Chinatown guy in 1963 or 1964 San Fran. I don't mean to sound flippant, but jkd today is the reality, and the past is gone. The real question is not whether jkd can beat kung-fu or tae-kwon do, but what is its relation to mma, the current craze.

you can ask ten jkd'ers and get ten different answers

[herrickdaube]

re:

I have been reading martial art forums for a while now, and I don't pretend to know much more than anyone else who reads Black Belt.
Questions: is jkd the same as mma? Or is it mma but out of an unorthodox stance? If jkd is not the same as mma, then how is it different or better?
Sorry if these seem like naive questions, but this issue is pressing on my mind alot more than if Bruce got beat-up by some Chinatown guy in 1963 or 1964 San Fran. I don't mean to sound flippant, but jkd today is the reality, and the past is gone. The real question is not whether jkd can beat kung-fu or tae-kwon do, but what is its relation to mma, the current craze.

[lucidmist]

Good points, Lucid; I stand corrected. Good job.

Lucid, Knuckles:

Here's another cool 5 clips (connected to this one) - but for the tragedy, the opening of the first clip would've been an awesome team up - WOW!

Also, either the first or the second clip has a piece of rare footage which, but for some pictures, I've never seen. Lee is wearing a stripped shirt and jabs at someone with lightning speed. Keep your eyes peeled or you'll miss it! There's still more out there! Enjoy!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9L5HMSroh4

P.S. Try not to fall in love with Shannon's beauty - what a doll - God bless her, and keep her safe.

Hey man, nah, I'm not much of a film critic, but everyone has different tastes I guess, and those just didn't sit well with me.

Thanks for the clips! Interesting stuff.. but too bad, they always recycle the same demonstration clips.. I wonder if there are more.

[Liberty]

Good points, Lucid; I stand corrected. Good job.

Lucid, Knuckles:

Here's another cool 5 clips (connected to this one) - but for the tragedy, the opening of the first clip would've been an awesome team up - WOW!

Also, either the first or the second clip has a piece of rare footage which, but for some pictures, I've never seen. Lee is wearing a stripped shirt and jabs at someone with lightning speed. Keep your eyes peeled or you'll miss it! There's still more out there! Enjoy!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9L5HMSroh4

P.S. Try not to fall in love with Shannon's beauty - what a doll - God bless her, and keep her safe.

[lucidmist]

"acting unacting"

No problem. Have you seen this one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKFMCwC_iTQ

For me, it's one of the best ones so far. Due to it's clarity, so much is evident about Lee's ability to generate power not only from such a short distance, but from an absolute standstill. Yeah, some knuckle head will prove himself one by replying with whatever, negative, derogatory nonsense they can come up with. That's cool. Let em miss out on how much is in the clip about the human body's potential.

Lee strikes as if pulled (just as he wrote - that a strike should be practiced/delivered as if one has been pulled by something outside oneself, or words to that effect), the torque behind his delivery, and so much more for the more astute - all indicating a highly developed delivery system, not just some movie actor acting. By the way, it's the same seeming pull of his punches (by some outside force) on that heavy bag that so called Bruce Lee expert, Miller failed to see.

By the way, I have to disagree with you regarding your comments on Lee's choreography. Lee was / is untouchable in fight choreography.

In fact, almost every single movie critic since and now agree on that - do the research (not that it matters that much!)

Anyway, enjoy the clip.

Yo man, thanks again!

Well, plenty of people degrade him as if they knew more, or are better than he was. Heh.. dreamers.

Ok... for the fight scenes, I really didn't like the scenes where Bruce or Norris did kicks directly into the camera. Don't know, I thought those were redundant. Also, in group fight scenes, the thugs almost always attack one at a time. And in instances where Bruce handled guys facing him, someone behind would, instead of striking the back of his head or body, try to grab his shoulders and get struck intead. Heh, unless my back is to the wall, I've never had someone attack me from behind by grabbing my shoulders, instead of choking my neck or striking my head with a helmet or back with a stool. Also, the thugs in Bruce's movies seem to freeze everytime he does a running flying kick. Lol.. they just stand there and let him fly-kick with a running start. But hey, not slamming, these are just the bits I find corny. And it doesn't undermine his fighting prowess, just that I suppose he needed those parts in to make things more interesting. If he did it like a real fight, all the scenes would probably be too short.

[Knuckles&Knees]

"acting unacting"

No problem. Have you seen this one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKFMCwC_iTQ

For me, it's one of the best ones so far. Due to it's clarity, so much is evident about Lee's ability to generate power not only from such a short distance, but from an absolute standstill. Yeah, some knuckle head will prove himself one by replying with whatever, negative, derogatory nonsense they can come up with. That's cool. Let em miss out on how much is in the clip about the human body's potential.

Lee strikes as if pulled (just as he wrote - that a strike should be practiced/delivered as if one has been pulled by something outside oneself, or words to that effect), the torque behind his delivery, and so much more for the more astute - all indicating a highly developed delivery system, not just some movie actor acting. By the way, it's the same seeming pull of his punches (by some outside force) on that heavy bag that so called Bruce Lee expert, Miller failed to see.

By the way, I have to disagree with you regarding your comments on Lee's choreography. Lee was / is untouchable in fight choreography.

In fact, almost every single movie critic since and now agree on that - do the research (not that it matters that much!)

Anyway, enjoy the clip.

I agree, Liberty, he surely did have some astounding power.

[Liberty]

Man, T-H-A-N-K-S! Interesting stuff, and finally, Longbeach demo in color.

"acting unacting"

No problem. Have you seen this one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKFMCwC_iTQ

For me, it's one of the best ones so far. Due to it's clarity, so much is evident about Lee's ability to generate power not only from such a short distance, but from an absolute standstill. Yeah, some knuckle head will prove himself one by replying with whatever, negative, derogatory nonsense they can come up with. That's cool. Let em miss out on how much is in the clip about the human body's potential.

Lee strikes as if pulled (just as he wrote - that a strike should be practiced/delivered as if one has been pulled by something outside oneself, or words to that effect), the torque behind his delivery, and so much more for the more astute - all indicating a highly developed delivery system, not just some movie actor acting. By the way, it's the same seeming pull of his punches (by some outside force) on that heavy bag that so called Bruce Lee expert, Miller failed to see.

By the way, I have to disagree with you regarding your comments on Lee's choreography. Lee was / is untouchable in fight choreography.

In fact, almost every single movie critic since and now agree on that - do the research (not that it matters that much!)

Anyway, enjoy the clip.