To all BJJ Advanced Belts

[Mr. Miyagi]

who cares if you get your black belt in a certain time or not? you should just train because you love it. good teachers understand that not every student is going to make juijitsu their career, just do you best to train when you can. Even if you're a white belt for three more years you should still train as long as you love it.

i don't know any brown or black belts that aren't athletic, in great shape, and very hard working. even purple, pretty much same thing. i know a few blue belts that trudged their way there, like myself.

it's not only gracies with high standards. you can't say a machado brown would be a gracie purple, or anything ridiculous like that. i actually don't know of any bjj instructors that give out purples, browns, or blacks easily. some give out blues a little easier than others, but that doesn't really matter; the truth can easily come out in a tournament.

[Sean Dempsey]

white to blue is nothing, you could get a blue belt LEGIT in like 6 months if you're dedicated. Some basic escapes, positions, submissions...

blue to purple.. .that's serious. That's like 4 years of hard work, dedicated training, really staying committed. There's no such thing as a casual purple belt.

purple to brown, that's about another 4-5 years of hard work too. I am talking like training 4 days a week, 3 hours a day, doing seminars, tournaments...

Brown to black... if you are a BJJ Brown Belt, BJJ *IS* your career. Same for black belts.

[GuardMaster]

BJJ Brown Belt and Up

What I can't undertstand is why at the brown and black belt level BJJ has to be ones "career".

In most other M.A.'s You can attain a blackbelt and still have a career outside MA. But it seems like in BJJ if you want to achieve this rank you can't have a full time career to pay the bills??????
BJJ as a full time career is lousy. No money in it unless your elite...

GM

[Thai Bri]

Its just that their standards are so high. As I understand it, a BJJ Black Belt can take on 99.99999% of the world in what they do. Whereas other arts have Black Belts that couldn't knock the skin off a rice pudding.

I think that Judo has it about right. Their Black Belts really have to prove themselves, but they don't have to be supermen.

[doubleouch]

No offense, but you can always tell a new person by their interest in gaining rank quickly. After you have been around the arts for awhile your obsession with rank fades. You realize that it really is a straw man. I have found that those who are overly concerned with rank never last. Those who train for the enjoyment will be around for awhile. I would say don't let BJJ rule your life. Train as often as you are comfortable with. Have fun. If it stops being fun then it's not worth it. If BJJ becomes something stressful in your life then why train?

[Sean Dempsey]

Re: BJJ Brown Belt and Up

Originally posted by GuardMaster
What I can't undertstand is why at the brown and black belt level BJJ has to be ones "career".

In most other M.A.'s You can attain a blackbelt and still have a career outside MA. But it seems like in BJJ if you want to achieve this rank you can't have a full time career to pay the bills??????
BJJ as a full time career is lousy. No money in it unless your elite...

GM

...

/shrug

Do whatever the hell you want, be a BJJ blackbelt training 3 hours a week, I don't care.

You want to become part of the elite, SMALL pool of BJJ black belts, great.

But, what you are saying is like saying you want a 700 lb bench press (there's probably more guys who can clean, DRUG FREE bench 700 than there are BJJ black belts...), by only doing some pushups and bench work once every other week.

Can you get a 700 lb. drug free bench press from doing chest exercises twice a month? no.

To be a black or brown belt, it's your "career" just like any other olympic athelete. These BJJers are world class, "olympic" caliber atheletes.

That's how it is. Ask the same question, but say "I want to enter the olympics as a sprinter, but I only have time to maybe train 3 days a week".

Up until your last post, I could sympathize, but now, you're trying to blow out the candles of other BJJ black belts you pour their WHOLE LIFE AND SOUL into their art, because you want to be a black belt and still have time for Bingo on thursdays and watching reruns of Seinfeld at 9.

Black Belts in BJJ and Olympic class atheletes are the same thing, as far as commitment and drive and DEDICATION and skill level in their respective sports. I'd say it's harder to be a Black Belt than it is to place Silver in the 100m. Are you gonna tell the sprinter who gets the Silver medal in 2004 that you want the same thing by running 3 days a week and still have time for your career as a computer programmer?

You are entitled to nothing, 3 days a week probably isn't enough to get past blue belt. Go fucking ask a black belt what it takes, there's gotta be at least 1 you could call or talk to. This isn't TKD where time = belts. This is BJJ, where unless you are a brilliant fighter who is carved out of wood, you aren't gonna get any farther than purple.

[michaelarsanis]

I think a consistent 3 days a week is good enough to learn and progress up until purple or so depending on your abilities to learn.

A black belt in BJJ is an elite athlete so it takes more time as in any other sport.

Your question regarding other martial art blackbelts is easily answered. In the martial arts community a black belt does not signify an elite martial artist nor is it supposed to. But rather in the overwheliming majority of arts, a blackbelt signifies that one is competent in the basics. Thats all. It AFTER you get your blackbelt that you really begin to learn.

Now BJJ is the exception. In BJJ to acheive a blackbelt really is elite. So a purple belt in BJJ would in my opinion be the equivalent of a black belt in other arts as far as competency and knowledge.

You're worried a bout rank too much. Just go train and see if you can even make it to blue belt first. 90% of the people don't even do that before quitting. Worry about your backbelt 8 years from now.

[Sean Dempsey]

So a purple belt in BJJ would in my opinion be the equivalent of a black belt in other arts as far as competency and knowledge.

That's probably about right.

[Mr. Miyagi]

I'd say a bjj blue belt could be the equivalent of a black belt in some other arts.

As to attaining a black belt, I think times have changed. You can't be a hard working but physically ungifted, weak person and get a black belt. I don't know of any that don't have incredible wiry strength, and excellent conditioning. People like to use some of the smaller bjj guys like BJ Penn, Royler, Matt Serra as examples, but those guys are very strong, tough, and conditioned with or without bjj.
I have trouble believing that Helio Gracie was the weakling who was saved by bjj that he's been made out to be. I think he was probably quite a wiry, strong guy when he was younger. He would have to have been.

[kid_chocolate]

re

Of course he was, why would bjj be different from any other sport?

[IPON]

Re: Rank and Career

Originally posted by GuardMaster
I want to be doing this sport into my 70's if possible like Gene Lebell.

In 10 years time I hope I can attain a Black Belt in BJJ training consistently 3 times a week. If this is not possible in BJJ then I may have to settle for a lower rank like brown or purple in BJJ, and supplement my study with other grappling arts like shoot wrestling, judo, submission grappling etc to attain a black belt.
GM

Guard master I have a few comments:

1. "Judo" Gene Lebelle is a master grappler and probably has studied some BJJ but is not a bjj stylist per se. But more importantly Helio is still going strong in his 90's

2. I think you may have answered your own question regarding amount of time to practice. if you were to supliment BJJ with another style, particulay grappling, you would be training 6 days a week anyway so why not divest that time into BJJ. Now if you felt you wanted to be more well rounded and wanted to add boxing or take MT that may be different, but rember your primary style would be BJJ.

3. I think all grapling arts are performance based, so it is not just time but EFFORT that is important. Typically, it takes 4-5 years for BB in Judo and from what Sean is saying it is about the same time it takes for Purple in BJJ (which by comparrison could be a 2nd dan in some karate styles-that is the difference in grappling styles). I don't see this as better or worse (for grappling styles), the ranking system is just differnt for BJJ. So by comparision a 2nd dan in judo would be equal to a typical BB in BJJ in terms of years of committment (and a grandmaster in Karate ).

4. What is your goal, why BJJ? Do you want SD, competition, to teach, or just a BB. If its that latter I agree with everyone just roll and enjoy your self and don't worry about a BB or switch to a style that has less requirements. I just think these are the questions you have to ask yourself. I only ask becuase I feel grappling, while it may look great and hardcore, is not for everyone. When people hit the mat they realize how difficult grappling can be. I think the best way to answer your question is ask your instructor. If you have not started, again, I would ask yourself the questions above.

All MAs should be serious business and training is everyday, even if you are only in class 3-4 days a week. How are you training and practicing outside of class. Weight training, sleep, diet etc.



Sean is it possible, in thoery, to obtain a BB without ever competing in sport JJ or VT or basically if someone is just interested in teaching they have a ceiling at purple belt. Just curious

[IPON]

Re: BJJ Brown Belt and Up

Originally posted by GuardMaster
BJJ as a full time career is lousy. No money in it unless your elite...GM

If you have a BB in BJJ you are an elite athlete...period. I think that is the point.

[Sean Dempsey]

Sean is it possible, in thoery, to obtain a BB without ever competing in sport JJ or VT or basically if someone is just interested in teaching they have a ceiling at purple belt. Just curious

Sure, my good friend is a purple belt, almost brown, and he is our teacher, he's not a competitive BJJ person, he's more of the technical, method, professor type. But he still is superb and awesome, and he'll no doubt make black.

[jules]

if you think a black belt is hard to get in BJJ try getting the mythical "red belt"..

[GuardMaster]

Training BJJ

Thanks Guys for all your feedback, especially IPON, your posts were very informative. Keep it coming!

I do believe that trying to attain blackbelt in BJJ is more difficult than say trying to attain purple belt in BJJ and supplementing my training with shootwrestling or judo for blackbelts. I feel these other styles make attaining blacklbelts not necessarily easier but more realistic for someone like myself with a career.

If I completely dedicate myself to attaining a blackbelt in BJJ I may literally have to change my whole lifestyle make BJJ my life, open a school or teach at one fulltime, teach at seminars etc etc. Basically should I give up a job that pays $70,000 a year for one that pays $28,000. Let's see... hmmmm... thinking.... thinking somemore..... NOOOOOOOTTTTT!

If I was young and dumb maybe I would take that path, but i'm older and smarter now so now I'm going after the path that brings both lucrative rewards as well as personal growth (MA).

GM