Mixed Martial Arts, One of the oldest forms of fighting.

[Garland]

**** this shit...let's talk about something important...like why bi-sexual girls are evil fucking fucks just out to destroy the hearts and souls of well meaning and naive men. Succubi. Evil. Scandalous and evil.

[knifethrower]

Confirming and confirming and confirming…huffing and puffing..

Damn, what a whiny little bitch!

Go little engine bunny, Go! WAHOO!!!!!

[Uke]

So it's your contention that any fighting method that's truly effective will work for everyone? Small large, fat, skinny, out of shape, athletic, man, or woman? You're suggesting that any "real" combat method should work across the board equally for my twelve year old cousin as well as it does for me? This one doesn't even need me to blow it apart. It's too flimsy to stand on its own. Please, fo the sake of clarification, give me an example of the kind of art that does not favor one type of person over another. Just one example will be fine.

Its my contention that there are systems that are put together much better than others and can be used by anyone who will put the time in learning. The Grandmaster of my system was 5'1 and lucky if he was 110lbs. He was more then formidable. There are fat people who are excellent in my system. There are short people who are excellent in my system. There are tall people who are excellent in my system. There are women who are excellent in my system. And its not just my system. There are many other systems that address the fact that everyone will not be strong, or tall or exceptionally conditioned. Men nor women have to be professionally trained athletes to perform or be effective in combatives. Men MUST be in professional level condition to be effective in MMA.

That's why correction officers, who arguably have the most dangerous job, train in SD combatives to handle America's most dangerous criminals, not MMA. If you were to begin kickboxing or shoot in an a guy acting irate in prison, you're going to either get fucked up or die. Prisoners carry weapons. Prisoners will stick together for a chance to hurt or cripple a CO. So you'd have to be crazy to tell someone to fight a man with nothing to lose in that manner. Mike will tell you to do rolling leglocks and flying armbars, but what he won't tell you is that you'll get a shank to the neck for your troubles.

Please do! And videotape it so you can post the hysterics here. In fact, go back and print off the list of all seven points I just listed and present them to this reputable school you're visiting. Since the training philosophy mirrors places I've already mentioned - like Paul Vunak's place and the Inosanto Academy - I'd be very, very interested to see which "reputable instructors" laugh you out the door. Preparing for mass attack and weapons, training with athleticism, learning to relax and think under pressure, and sparring hard against skilled, well-conditioned, and resisting opponents? Oh my God! You're right. I've lost my mind. And to address the point about me speaking as an authority on subjects I admit to knowing nothing about? The only other post we're discussing is the soft vs hard styles thread, and in that I have admitted time and time and time again that I don't know what it's all about. I've also asked repeatedly for explanations. I don't see how that is "speaking as an authority." What sounds to me like the kind of behavior you're talking about is when BoarSpear admits to knowing nothing about MMA, admits to not following it or any other sport, and admits that he doesn't even know who any of the premier athletes are - but still professes to tell everyone how ineffective it is! Get your arguments right!

When you write "Preparing for mass attack and weapons, training with athleticism, learning to relax and think under pressure, and sparring hard against skilled, well-conditioned, and resisting opponents", you're assuming that self defense schools aren't already doing this without MMA framework! MMA is less than 10 years old, and you speak as if those qualities ONLY came about since MMA's inception! This is why many people, not only myself have told you that maybe YOUR school lacked those elements and you had to find them through MMA, but that doesn't apply to most reputable schools. And you do try to speak as an authority about EVERYTHING, even when its clear that you're bullshitting as you along! I'm hardly the only who thinks so:

If I say Boxing is an external style you say it can’t be. If I told you there was a cure for cancer and had the proof for it. You would say “no impossible” where you are not involved in medical research to have that opinion. So who is really bias here? Thai Bri has very rigid opinions on certain topics but I could always end a conversation with we agree to disagree. This is not "I'MRIGHTALWAYS.NET", but I feel it is Mike’s way or no way, eventhough you dsay you want to learn - complete hypocrisy. Why is that? I do have respect for things that you have posted. I don’t care that you don’t like or agree with anything I post (its just discussion we can agree to disagree) but don’t respond if you don’t understand or better yet respond to understand.

But you ignore messages like that despite them being from posters who are not argumentative. How much more polite yet truthful could IPON have been?

You're right. The literal hundreds of encounters I've had are purely speculative. The dozen upon dozen of people I've controlled using the very same kinds of techniques used in the MMA ring are just things that "might" happen. The fact that I developed a toughness and work ethic from training similar to MMA (even before there was such a term) was not relevant at all. Uke, let me ask you how it is that 26 years of doing this stuff personally, and at least 14 years of applying it in real world situations against armed and unarmed individulas and groups constitutes speculation. Since you're apt to dodge every other point I make, please, at least have the common decency to answer this one. What more personal proof can I offer besides the scars I carry, and the fact that I am not only still here and uncrippled, but that my decisions about which techniques and level of force to use has stood up in court every single time? I won in both the street itself and in the courtroom. Doesn't that count as more than "maybe?" If not, please tell me what does, since I have to assume that reports by the Defense Department and the soldiers on the ground who are using this amidst one of the toughest wartime environments since Vietnam are also using it with (thus far) 100% effectiveness are just "speculation" as well.

This is the funniest part of your stance. You always fall back on what you've done. And in POST #125 that you never addressed, this was written and it sums up this point:

Anybody who would teach their students to attempt risky, unnecessary and flashy techniques doesn't deserve to have students. When your justification of teaching sportive methods to your students as a means of self defense is "I've pulled it off before", then you should never teach.

Why write that you've been doing these things for 26 years when you wrote you only studied with Vunak for 3 years? Learning classical karate, tae kwon do or judo isn't combatives, as they are in this day and age sportive and don't put emphasis on weapons. So what are you talking about?

Actually, the reputable school that hosts this very forum claims that MMA is a good way to supplement reality based training. So do the others I've listed, and many, many more. And for your information, the most successful schools in my area are Universal Kempo Karate (which teaches primarily kids in the "street lethal" form of tournament Kempo that's made them famous, and the Defense Institute, which is THE premier school for reality based arts in my area. And guess what? They teach boxing, kickboxing, and MMA right along side their other stuff, and they encourage their students to train across the board because (shock of all shocks) they know it helps.

The Defense Institute is THEE premier school for reality in your area and state? Well Mike Brewer, the reality methods in that school come FROM MY SCHOOL in NY as the men who teach SD there are from VAJ and not the Mike Brewer School of MMA and boxing! I'm glad that you know what is premier and what belongs in a gym hitting speed bags. They might teach boxing and kickboxing and MMA as a conditioning and cardio method, but the curriculum of VAJ is a strict one that the founder and heir will not allow anyone using the name to deviate from. VAJ is taught the SAME everywhere so that we don't have the problems that JKD has concerning everybody doing what they want and calling it JKD. There's a time for MMA, and then there's a time when your ass is on the line and you need SD to keep you alive from weapons and multiple attackers.

I've given you corroboration of experts - namely Paul Vunak, Dan Inosanto, the Dog Brothers, etc. to back up my own experience. And all you've come up with it "Mike can't address the facts?"

You haven't given a corroboration of anything. There are men more qualified under Inosanto than you in NY/NJ alone that will tell you that MMA will definitely get you in great shape and is good for toughness, but it isn't the smartest or even a practical way to fight in the street. Vunak is a weapons man, and if he said that people should use MMA's current skillset and fighting methods in the street, then he's on drugs again. I've got the backbone to point that out.

And by the way, if you're calling working in and from the guard "MMA" then you're wrong yet again, Mike Brewer. Newaza has been a part of jujitsu and combatives before MMA ever existed. MMA isn't even a real system. Its a buzzword used to describe kickboxers who use submission wrestling in NHB events.

Maybe you and your instructors would advocate kickboxing and shooting in for submissions against unfamiliar attackers who may or may not be armed in a streetfight, but then again that's why you're not premier even in your own neck of the woods.

All in all, this is a great debate because more and more of your opinions keep telling on you.

[jubaji]

Men MUST be in professional level condition to be effective in MMA. .

Says the insecure little fish for the 100,000,000th time...

[jubaji]

That's why correction officers, who arguably have the most dangerous job, train in SD combatives to handle America's most dangerous criminals, not MMA. If you were to begin kickboxing or shoot in an a guy acting irate in prison, you're going to either get fucked up or die.

Bullshit. That, like everything else, is relative to the specific situation. (of course)

[jubaji]

There are short people who are excellent in my system. There are tall people who are excellent in my system. There are women who are excellent in my system. .

And the people who are bigger/stronger/faster and equally skilled in your system have no advantage over those who are smaller/slower/weaker?

.....................

[knifethrower]

And the people who are bigger/stronger/faster and equally skilled in your system have no advantage over those who are smaller/slower/weaker?

There’s always going to be someone better than you…he may be bigger/stronger/faster or he may not. He may be good with a knife, good with a gun or just ready when you weren’t. You work with what you got. Anyway, that’s what I got out of the post…

Says the insecure little fish for the 100,000,000th time...

You’re just pissed cuz you’re thinking there may be a better way to train and you don’t want to take the time to change your game………..

Bullshit. That, like everything else, is relative to the specific situation. (of course)

Yeah, just suplex the guy with the shank…

Keep try’n engine bunny….keep try’n

[jubaji]

Anyway, that’s what I got out of the post…

That maybe what you got out of it, but not what went into it.

You’re just pissed cuz you’re thinking there may be a better way to train and you don’t want to take the time to change your game………..

Completely wrong, but thanks for guessing.

Yeah, just suplex the guy with the shank…

Do whatever you have to with the guy with or without the shank.

Theory-boy can sit on his internal ass and speculate all day, but my friend worked as a corrections officer for ten years, had quite a few run-ins with unruly inmates, and agrees with my statement above completely.

[JustaFighter]

Correct me if I'm wrong...

As I see it, Mike is just stating that there is no one complete style/system of training that will make you capable of all situations from minor control of an individual to "Oh Sh!t three people with weapons." It's up to the fighter to correctly train in proper principles to handle whatever real situations life may throw your way that involves some form of force on another person(s). Mike is just stating that there are good principles and options in MMA that can compliment the RBSD practitioner.

I think Mike's right. If I understand Mike. He believes that you are to become the best fighter you can be in whatever situation. Not the best TKD person, or JKD person, ect. But as an individual, the best you can be in truely/honestly winning the physical altercation.

That's just how I see it.

[knifethrower]

Theory-boy can sit on his internal ass and speculate all day

Theory-boy? Keep on truckin little bunny rabbit...keep on truckin....

Do whatever you have to with the guy with or without the shank.....my friend worked as a corrections officer for ten years, had quite a few run-ins with unruly inmates, and agrees with my statement above completely.

Ooooooooooooooo! jubaji's friend said so! Well, lets just everybody get togather and have a big suplex party!

WAHOO GET THE BEER! IT'S SUPLEX TIME!







* your friend said so...what a fukin joke

[jubaji]

Theory-boy?

Yes, 'theory-boy.'

Ooooooooooooooo! jubaji's friend said so! * your friend said so...what a fukin joke

You're right, anecdotes are proof of nothing, and I don't imagine you are inclined to believe me anyway. And of course pUke will soon start shouting, "exception to the rule! exception to the rule!" like he does every time one of his silly generalizations is refuted. However, it is interesting that you are quick to scoff at my personal information from the real world but even quicker to accept anything that pUke pulls out his ass.

...and quickest of all to climb on up in Boring's ass yourself!

[BoarSpear]

That's why correction officers, who arguably have the most dangerous job, train in SD combatives to handle America's most dangerous criminals, not MMA. If you were to begin kickboxing or shoot in an a guy acting irate in prison, you're going to either get fucked up or die. Prisoners carry weapons. Prisoners will stick together for a chance to hurt or cripple a CO. So you'd have to be crazy to tell someone to fight a man with nothing to lose in that manner. Mike will tell you to do rolling leglocks and flying armbars, but what he won't tell you is that you'll get a shank to the neck for your troubles.

Very well said Bro...The correction officers, Leo's and soldiers I know ALL laugh at MMA concepts for SD..perhaps my favorite slam of all is the "You can't tap out on the street" shirts the Swat Units and SF guys are all starting to wear...their experiences outside the ring have made their feelings so clear shirts are being made..thats reality for you.

If you can't expect prisoners in Maximum security prisons to be unarmed, who can you expect to be? Oh yeah, the other guy in tights....

The Defense Institute is THEE premier school for reality in your area and state? Well Mike Brewer, the reality methods in that school come FROM MY SCHOOL in NY as the men who teach SD there are from VAJ and not the Mike Brewer School of MMA and boxing! I'm glad that you know what is premier and what belongs in a gym hitting speed bags. They might teach boxing and kickboxing and MMA as a conditioning and cardio method, but the curriculum of VAJ is a strict one that the founder and heir will not allow anyone using the name to deviate from. VAJ is taught the SAME everywhere so that we don't have the problems that JKD has concerning everybody doing what they want and calling it JKD. There's a time for MMA, and then there's a time when your ass is on the line and you need SD to keep you alive from weapons and multiple attackers.

Hehehehehe isn't it funny how he walked right into that one

[BoarSpear]

You’re just pissed cuz you’re thinking there may be a better way to train and you don’t want to take the time to change your game………..



Yeah, just suplex the guy with the shank…

Keep try’n engine bunny….keep try’n

BWAHAHAHA!!! ROFLMAO

[BoarSpear]

Uke, you and Boar have both accused me of being a liar over and over again. So in the interest of maintaining honesty, please quote me where I even once advocated either of these things. Show me even once where I said that a flying armbar was ever a good idea. I won't even ask you to keep it to this conversation. You're reaching. You're floundering. And now you're lying about what I've said because your arguments have crumbled yet again. You are lying, Uke, about what I said, because you can't dispute what I really wrote. You're lying, Uke, because it's the only thing you can do to argue the point. You're lying because the best you can do at this point is dispute your own lie, rather than what I said. Quote me, Uke. Of face up to the fact that in this case - you're the liar.

Thats rich, the King of misquotes and lying calling someone else on his very game.

[BoarSpear]

No, Uke, I'm not. I'm suggesting that it is an acceptable option. At no time - not once - have I said that these same results can't be achieved without MMA methods and material. I never said it. Find it and quote me if you think I did.

Find me a Martial art related thread you haven't slammed everyone who doesn't do MMA as not being prepared for SD.

You went so far as to ignore it when I pointed out DARIA's flat statement that a MMA guy with a knife was better prepared for a knife fight than ANY FMA person because FMA is all bs, but MMA people train at 100 percent resistance (which is utter crap ....The MCMAP guidelines CLEARLY STATE ANY RESISTANCE over 30 PERCENT CAUSES TOO MANY INJURIES AND IS TO BE AVIODED) )YOU ignored multiple pms from me calling you out on that thread..you wouldn't touch it because you were afraid to talk bad about MMA at all...surely you remember that...it's the one where I decided discussing martial arts here was a waste of time since you had an agenda...I think we all remember how you responded.