Sriking take down

[USArmyBJJ]

Try THIS> if you can TIME the trap to pin his foot at the moment he needs it to retreat he may fall down without further contact...

These takedowns seem to require a pretty precise level of timing and accuracy in trapping the foot. Do you think that that level of timing and accuracy is likely in a real fight? Or, that it has as high a percentage of success as, say, a normal Judo-style takedown?

[Bjjexpertise@be]

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Interesting... I've seen very similar foot trap takedowns in Kali...

(knee push)


Try THIS> if you can TIME the trap to pin his foot at the moment he needs it to retreat he may fall down without further contact...



Just try it... It's FUN!

Or sweep it, a la de-ashi-barai , same principle.

[kingoftheforest]

These takedowns seem to require a pretty precise level of timing and accuracy in trapping the foot. Do you think that that level of timing and accuracy is likely in a real fight? Or, that it has as high a percentage of success as, say, a normal Judo-style takedown?

It's no more precise than any thing else requires you to be.

It's just a different set of timings is all. It's more of a timing that will hopefully end the fight quicker.

Less of a dance and more of an attack. it's also based on the fact that your opponent is going to be moving, either retreating or advancing, not just standing in front of you waiting.

Also you are not tying up your hands by grabbing the person.

[kingoftheforest]

WWII combatives use the technique in a similar way.

Incorporating a stomp kick that slides down the opponents shin and slams into the top of their foot.

At the same time in WWII combatives you would use the chin jab. You basically jam your open hand into the opponents throat forcing their head backwards.

In KF they call it disrupting the 3 harmonies (those being upper=head middle=waist and lower=legs.).


When you disrupt 2 of the harmonies or sections of the body it causes your opponent to lose his root or balance.


The video shows a disruption of the lower and middle harmonies.

If the persons tries to gain your back with their foot staked they will have to find a way to leave there foot behind to move around you.


I'm sure Mr. Potato Head could manage it but most people don't have detachable appendages.


If you don't see it try having someone stand on your foot while you step behind them. You'll see even if you do get your foot out you are seriously off balance.

[Tant01]

practice...

These takedowns seem to require a pretty precise level of timing and accuracy in trapping the foot. Do you think that that level of timing and accuracy is likely in a real fight? Or, that it has as high a percentage of success as, say, a normal Judo-style takedown?

Timing and accuracy are IMPORTANT factors with ANY technique...

If you get it right it looks perfectly effortless. I like it.

[Tant01]

Variations

I've trained that in Kali myself before, and as with anything timing is important. Your right on the money with that.

Any technique will fail without proper timing, range, position and execution. These things are inherent in any MA, and are the reason practice is essential. It's been said before it's not just the MA it's the practitioner as well.

You get what you put into it like anything else in this world.

There are other variations of this foot trap takedown but I can't find vid clips...

Knee to knee (push) with a foot trap? This one is cool because you functionally do a COMBINATION technique with one leg...

knee push (hand) with the foot trap.

All good stuff!

[kingoftheforest]

There are other variations of this foot trap takedown but I can't find vid clips...

Knee to knee (push) with a foot trap? This one is cool because you functionally do a COMBINATION technique with one leg...

knee push (hand) with the foot trap.

All good stuff!

I love the knee push hand technique, if you can manage to get that low you're out of the opponents field of view for just a second.

[jubaji]

If the persons tries to gain your back with their foot staked they will have to find a way to leave there foot behind to move around you.

They don't have to move their foot. They want to have their body right on his. If you had some experience grappling this would be clear to you. You can see in the vid that he turns his shoulder to the other man and leaves a hand right where you would want it to take wrist control.

If this low-percentage move doesn't work out exactly as you hope you have turned your shoulder into the opponent, left a hand where it is liable to be controlled, and of course while standing on his foot yours is immobile as well which works out great for the other guy if he wants to get his body on yours and control you.

Could it work? Absolutely. Worth betting your ass on? Only if you are dealing with someone you are far superior to anyway. IMO.

[jubaji]

I love the knee push hand technique, if you can manage to get that low you're out of the opponents field of view for just a second.

Sounds like you'd love a good low outside single!

[Tant01]

With weapons...

Quote:
Originally Posted by kingoftheforest
I love the knee push hand technique, if you can manage to get that low you're out of the opponents field of view for just a second.

Sounds like you'd love a good low outside single!

I almost went on a single leg tangent with my last post but stopped short of basic and EFFECTIVE single leg takedowns, ankle picks or more destructive atemi waza... (Kensetsu jeri?)

The foot trap with a knee push is the GENTLE way to topple. I can play it with my kids... What I DO NOT teach them is how to DESTROY the joint...

That may come in time if they ever put it all together for themselves.

empty hands can do some serious damage... all the better with some steel in your fist...

[Tant01]

Good to read Ju...

They don't have to move their foot. They want to have their body right on his. If you had some experience grappling this would be clear to you. You can see in the vid that he turns his shoulder to the other man and leaves a hand right where you would want it to take wrist control.

If this low-percentage move doesn't work out exactly as you hope you have turned your shoulder into the opponent, left a hand where it is liable to be controlled, and of course while standing on his foot yours is immobile as well which works out great for the other guy if he wants to get his body on yours and control you.

Could it work? Absolutely. Worth betting your ass on? Only if you are dealing with someone you are far superior to anyway. IMO.

Very good post...

Consider also the potential event with a blade or a brick? (stick?)

You don't need to be cut or pummeled to realize closing with a knife or bludgeon is dangerous business...

That "wrist control" could easily become a CRITICAL factor.

IMO...

[jubaji]

The foot trap with a knee push is the GENTLE way to topple. I can play it with my kids... What I DO NOT teach them is how to DESTROY the joint...

That may come in time if they ever put it all together for themselves....

Not a great leap to make. The sort of thing that can be found out by accident.

[jubaji]

That "wrist control" could easily become a CRITICAL factor.

IMO...

....................................................

Absolutely.

[Tant01]

Not a great leap to make. The sort of thing that can be found out by accident.

It sorta sucks to learn that stuff the hard way...

We play "it don't bend THAT way" for fun. Right now my little girl likes to use her whole body against a single joint and she's eager (at ten years and 102 lbs) to try a hip throw on Daddy...

[USArmyBJJ]

Timing and accuracy are IMPORTANT factors with ANY technique...

If you get it right it looks perfectly effortless. I like it.

Sure, of course. But there's a world of difference between the timing and accuracy needed to grab a large and relatively slow moving target (i.e. - the leg, for a wrestling or judo takedown) vs. a small and fast moving target (i.e. - the foot, in this case). Don't you agree?