Judo cont'd

[judoguy6]

Let's Mmake A Deal

Let's make a deal, Mr. Greenthing.

You go and fill out your Profile properly so I know I'm not dealing with a mental case and I'll answer your questions.

I'll give you my opinions, my advice and enough judo stories to fill your ying-yang -- and that has nothing to do with Shinto religion.

I've met and trained with many judo legends. I grew up with stories about Geesink, Inokuma, Kimura, etc. I even met Geesink and Kimura. I trained with most of the European stars of the 70's and many All-Japan, Olympic and World champions. I've got the ears and injuries to prove it.

Re-do your Profile...

[greenthing]

Consider it done .Did you know Lutz Lischka? I learned the Sweeping hip throw(osoto-gari) from him when I started back in 1972.
My first Judo coach was Diane Peirce Tudella , but John Holm taught me the vast majority of my Judo/ Juijitsu. Do you know anyone from Minnesota? Miguel Tudella?

So what do you think of the new Judo rule making bowing to inanimate objects voluntary?Do you think making all the bowing voluntary instead of mandatory would open up Judo to alot more people?

Do you feel insulted or personally attacked if someone questions the status quo concerning the classical approach to Judo?

So I know a few others that are all banged up was it worth it?
I knew a guy that had to have both hips replaced.33 years old.But he won the British Collegiate Championship. I think his injuries were from stretching wrong most probably a combination competition and overstretching. How are your knees?

[jubaji]

Originally posted by greenthing

So what do you think of the new Judo rule making bowing to inanimate objects voluntary?Do you think making all the bowing voluntary instead of mandatory would open up Judo to alot more people?

People don't have better things to worry about?

[Toudiyama[NL]]

Sorry I didn't reply Kev had written a post of about 30 line when a customer called and I clicked it away, usually after something like that I do not post much for a week

I will make a new thread about registered teachers and the academy and our orgs as well as I will try to explain the french situation ( one of the best systems for amateur sports)


I must tell you though I'm not a judoka anymore, never did matches to begin with ( that why I went from Korfball to Judo)
But am the son of a Judoteacher(retired) and am a Karateteacher with the same kind of instruction ( the psychology and other stuff I mentioned before)
I do not like Judo but will not diss it just because of that, neither will I call something bad if it isn't

Oh and the club I used to teach was more a judoclub then karate or jujitsu
They produced several Nat. champions and also the former
trainer of the Nat. team


Do you think American football should be less physical so it will atrackt more people ( namely women) seeing that outside of the US Football ( american) is a very small sport?

[judoguy6]

Well, Kevin, I'm glad we're all back on track here. Got to keep it short tonight because I've still got some work to do and it's already too late.

I have to tell you that I've been out of touch with competitive judo for the past 20 years or so because of business and family commitments. I'm familiar with Diane Peirce but not John Holm or Lischka.

The bowing issue is new to me. I'd have to ask some of my old teammates about that one. One of them, Wayne Erdman, still runs a judo club with boxing and other fighting arts. He's still on the mats taking care of the young, so-called tough guys. Wayne made mincemeat out of a lot of guys in his time, especially in newaza (ground technique).

Personally, bowing just came with the territory at the time and whether I bow or not makes no difference. I don't think that the fact that it is now voluntary will increase judo's popularity.

To me, there's no such thing as 'classical' or what? - 'modern' judo. There's only good judo and bad judo. You learn the basic fundamentals and then you customize your technique to suit your style. I didn't much care for the European-style which is very strength-oriented, very defensive and more like wrestling.

On the other hand, I've seen some really good judo by some European champions. By good judo, I mean that they were able to use their favorite techniques from any angle or movement.

Japanese judo, which you probably consider classical, is what judo was meant to be.

When I first went to Japan as a Shodan (1st Dan), I thought I was some hot shot who knew what judo was. What a shocker!
I didn't throw anybody for 6 months! Uemura, who later became All-Japan and World champion, tossed me around every day -- with the same throws. Shinomaki, world heavyweight champion, did a sommersault onto the mat with me on his back -- with all his 260 lbs almost breaking my rib cage. I was 165 lbs at the time.

There were so many great judo technicians such as Okano who felt like freight train when he did his kouchigari on you. Yamashita was a 17-year old high school student weighing about 230 lbs when I trained with him. He threw me when he wanted to -- from an upright, classical judo stance.

Classical judo is really just damn good judo technique.

Rainer

[greenthing]

Classical Judo would be Judo training methods basically the same as when it started 120 years ago.The old fashioned training methods with a culturally inappropriate adherance to the Japanese/Shinto religous ceremonies.
Competitive Judo would be training methods or philosophy adapted and improved upon by a modern society.

I totally agree with your good and bad explanation. There's just some new stuff thought up in the last three centuries(has it been that long). (1880's-2003).

John Holm taught Diane Peirce (Tudella). Lischka was Austrian
middle weight,Munich 1972.

[jubaji]

Originally posted by greenthing
The old fashioned training methods with a culturally inappropriate adherance to the Japanese/Shinto religous ceremonies.

You are a scared little boy...

[Szczepankiewicz]

Just for Kevin,

Every day when I get home from work I bow to the Garden Gnome what lives in my back yard...




Argh, I've been corrupted by all the Shinto/Zen/Bhuddist propaganda!!!!!!

Someone please help.

I cannot stop it even though I try.

Spanky
(At least I state my real hobby)

[judoguy6]

Garden Gnomes

It's best you stay on the good side of those gnomes -- I've seen enough Goosebumps shows to know how dangerous they can be.

Sometimes they'll even knock over your garbage cans at night and then blame it on the racoons.

Originally posted by Szczepankiewicz
Just for Kevin,

Every day when I get home from work I bow to the Garden Gnome what lives in my back yard...




Argh, I've been corrupted by all the Shinto/Zen/Bhuddist propaganda!!!!!!

Someone please help.

I cannot stop it even though I try.

Spanky
(At least I state my real hobby)

Goosebumps

[greenthing]

R U beating the dead horse again? M I?

I seen the horse move so I beat it some more. I just felt I needed to lecture Mr.Fischer about Judo.Pretty funny.
So were you a wrestler before Judo or always a Judoka?
You say you grew up around martial arts.Do you think Judo guys are toughest or what?
You ever used it in a fight ? What age did you strart training?
What is your best idea for training? Do you think people should go up to make weight or drop down.

[judoguy6]

New Judo Rules

From what I've been told, the IJF is updating competition rules to make judo more appealing to a larger audience.

There is to be no more handshaking at the end of a bout after the judoka have bowed to each other. Apparently this will save quite a bit of time over the course of a tournament day. It has nothing to do with religion or culture.

I also hear that the bent-over, defensive style popularized by the Europeans is being penalized when used in competition. As far as I'm concerned, that rule was loooong overdue. As World champion Sato of Japan said, "Stand up and fight like a man!

[greenthing]

Kano says in his book Kodokan Judo that it's a sport. Period. He says the two main aspects of Judo training are #1 development of the body ,and #2 training in attack and defense.

He treats the bowing as the same as most cultures treat handshakes.
Forced bowing is finished, it is in its final death throes
anyone can see they just have it backwards.The handshake is appropriate in all cultures.Its not against anybody's culture or religion to shake hands its a universally accepted practice especially in sports.
My Judo coach and his wife sued the national organizations over forced bowing to the mat.They lost the case because not enough people had" complained" but the rule was changed because the national organizations spent over $300.000 defending forced bowing and they can't afford another lawsuit.
So its just a matter of time before another lawsuit concerning forced bowing to your opponent is filed. Bye bye to forced bowing as this is the 21st century! That will open up Judo to alot more participation and alot more people will embrace watching it.

Our club was using colored suits in the early seventies what a revolutionary idea! Now its accepted practice or am I mistaken.

Competitive Judo has a big future they just have to look forward instead of backwards. I believe that Jigoro Kano being the amateur sportsman that he was ,would be all for the rule change. The new rule you speak of is an obvious knee jerk reaction. I mean banning the handshake? It's just like the knee jerk reaction rule to the fored bowing to inanimate objects lawsuit.They passed a rule banning the whole team if you refused to bow.

Clear minded people will see that the world didn't stop rotating because you aren't forced to bow to the mat anymore.
And they aren't trying to ban bowing,on the contrary it's just to make it voluntary. Nobody is trying to hijack Japan's national sport
they are striving to make it better! Judo will always be identified with the Japanese people just like baseball is American.

Imagine banning the handshake pretty goddamn funny!

And that bent over stuff was always just "stalling" anyway.

They have the Kano Society .That is their major premise "up right posture".Sounds like their input. Anyway it's good thing to watch a sport evolve. Kind of exciting.

[jubaji]

Originally posted by greenthing

Forced bowing is finished, it is in its final death throes
anyone can see they just have it backwards.The handshake is appropriate in all cultures.Its not against anybody's culture or religion to shake hands My Judo coach and his wife sued the national organizations over forced bowing to the mat.They lost the case because not enough people had" complained" but the rule was changed because the national organizations spent over $300.000 defending forced bowing and they can't afford another lawsuit. So its just a matter of time before another lawsuit concerning forced bowing to your opponent is filed. Bye bye to forced bowing as this is the 21st century! That will open up Judo to alot more participation and alot more people will embrace watching it. Clear minded people will see that the world didn't stop rotating because you aren't forced to bow to the mat anymore.

Psycho!

What a pathetic, twisted, obsessed little creep!

[Szczepankiewicz]

Pigs. Mud. Rasslin.

Need I say more?

[greenthing]

Hey you aren't supposed to call people names .

I am a pathetic twisted obsessed big creep .I weigh 290 and bench 350.
Lets play.