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  • Jon_B
    replied
    Originally posted by TKD Student View Post
    There is no such thing as the best kicking art. Everything is great if used the correct way.
    Though, Capoeira... I don't know if that would be effective in a fight... Sure, it's a beautiful art. I really love how it looks, but I don't think it's good in a fight.

    Taekwondo: Powerful and fast kicks, wich is good. A kick has more power than a punch. And a fast kick is even better.

    I would say the same about Kickboxing, and add that they punch more, which is more of a variation of techniques used. Also good. Don't know much of how fast it's techniques is though.

    Savate: I have never heard of this?
    Capoeira is just a late bloomer. The self-defense part of it is included, but how one uses it is undefined. You don't have a set stance (Only the really good capoeristas can do the ginga in street situation [Which I've observed in person]), or set attacks that you absolutely have to use in it, but there's many practical techniques for some, just as there are techniques that are impractical to others. It's highly subjective on how it is used. By itself it may not be the best, but there's some people from Brazil that mix it with BJJ (Or do the art with a Vale Tudo flow to it) to make a good all-arounder in cage fighting, and street situations. Other schools automatically incorporate BJJ in what they teach, and some include boxing as well. I consider it to be a good striking style (That has some grappling included).

    After a year Muay Thai, the average person will have learned enough to skills to defend themself.
    It would probably take at least 5-6 years to get that out of Capoeira. Perfecting techniques, developing unpredictability (And sometimes the ability to break the rhythm of your opponent), and gaining those cat-like reflexes take a while to perfect.

    I also agree with your statment about styles: I don't believe there is a best style either. I believe the kicks of our good friend JKD sort of mix of both muay thai style kicking (Not from the actual art, but the baseball bat swinging motion), and the more oriental art style kicking (i.e. A TKD roundhouse) just as an example.

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  • TKD Student
    replied
    There is no such thing as the best kicking art. Everything is great if used the correct way.
    Though, Capoeira... I don't know if that would be effective in a fight... Sure, it's a beautiful art. I really love how it looks, but I don't think it's good in a fight.

    Taekwondo: Powerful and fast kicks, wich is good. A kick has more power than a punch. And a fast kick is even better.

    I would say the same about Kickboxing, and add that they punch more, which is more of a variation of techniques used. Also good. Don't know much of how fast it's techniques is though.

    Savate: I have never heard of this?

    Leave a comment:


  • Jon_B
    replied
    Originally posted by tkd_wrestler View Post
    It's true there is no martial that has the absolute best kicks but for purposes of speed and effectiveness I always lean towards TKD. We're talk to kick high so we can do our leg kicks faster in a street fight.

    I have to say that I'm a big fan of Muay Thai and Capoeira's leg techniques. Muay thai for it's power and capoeira for it's sweeps.
    Capoeira kicks are almost synoymous (Not that they are rooted in each other, but they are very similar) with Tae Kwon Do kicks. I've taken both (Mostly Tae Kwon Do, but I know a little Capoeira):
    Martelo
    Chapa
    Gancho
    Ponteira
    Bencao
    -Giratoria
    -Pullando? (Spelling? )
    Queixada (Frontal)
    Armada
    Meia Lua De Frente
    Translates to:
    RoundHouse Kick
    Side Kick
    Hook Kick
    Front Snap Kick
    Front thrusting puch kick
    -"Spinning" action (Chapa giratoria [O escorpiao is the other term for it I think]- Spin side kick)
    -"Jumping" action (Bencao Pullando- Jumping Front Thrusting Push Kick)
    -Crescent Kick with an entrance (Frontal is a crescent without the entrance)
    -Spinning Crescent kick
    -Inside Crescent Kick
    I guess the fludity and motion is what really makes it different (That, and when you do moves in the roda, you usually stretch them as high as you can for training, rather than actually aiming [Except when you get close for some of the crazy combat stuff ] for the body).
    These were good choices though. Muay Thai for direct crushing power, Savate for grace, Tae Kwon Do for sheer speed, and Capoeira for unpredictable moves.
    Too bad I can't practice Capoeira anymore. Pensacola doesn't have any places that teach it... nor Muay Thai... nor savate..

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  • aku aku
    replied
    Originally posted by Jon_B View Post
    Savate kicking has it's roots in Muay Thai, but the kicks are very graceful, and the foot is the major part of the leg used.
    I've also heard that savate was influenced by the chinese and that it was developed independantly. I don't think there's enough proof of any theory for people to agree on its origins.

    Leave a comment:


  • tkd_wrestler
    replied
    Originally posted by Jon_B View Post
    I can't decide. Each of those arts have elements that make them diverse, but I don't think there is one ultimate kicking art.

    Tae Kwon Do has great kicks that can come at extreme heights, and speeds. It is not straightforward like Muay Thai, but it also isn't extremely unpredictable like Capoeira.
    It's true there is no martial that has the absolute best kicks but for purposes of speed and effectiveness I always lean towards TKD. We're talk to kick high so we can do our leg kicks faster in a street fight.

    I have to say that I'm a big fan of Muay Thai and Capoeira's leg techniques. Muay thai for it's power and capoeira for it's sweeps.

    Leave a comment:


  • Jon_B
    replied
    I can't decide. Each of those arts have elements that make them diverse, but I don't think there is one ultimate kicking art.

    Tae Kwon Do has great kicks that can come at extreme heights, and speeds. It is not straightforward like Muay Thai, but it also isn't extremely unpredictable like Capoeira.

    Capoeira is filled with malandragem (The art of trickery) and cunning. Capoeiristas learn great timing when armed against opponent. This coupled with malandragem and cunning, and the natural ability for them to react in angles and positions that are uncommon in other arts make this effective.

    Muay Thai makes your legs into great weapon with your hands. Analagous to the uncommon positions of Capoeira, Muay Thai teaches one how to effectively use almost their entire leg as an advantage.

    Savate kicking has it's roots in Muay Thai, but the kicks are very graceful, and the foot is the major part of the leg used.

    Leave a comment:


  • Warrior189
    replied
    Originally posted by mysteryninja View Post
    What is capoeira????? I've never heard of it!

    Cool video Piston
    here u go.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capoeira

    Leave a comment:


  • mysteryninja
    replied
    Originally posted by B.Y.O.B. View Post
    What is the most effective kicking art? And why?

    Well I say Capoeira, cause it has the advantage in the ground n can easily hit in the mid-section n the head.

    P.S. Im not tkdperson89.
    What is capoeira????? I've never heard of it!

    Cool video Piston

    Leave a comment:


  • Piston
    replied
    At my school we do practise knee stamps, ankle stamps (i.e low side kicks) check kicks and hooking legs out from underneath. This is mostly in one-step sparring though not in our actual sparring.

    Leave a comment:


  • spetnatz
    replied
    Originally posted by kuk sool won View Post
    Entirely depends on what type of TKD you are talking about. Yes, sporting TKD only includes upper body striking but there are so many aspects of TKD that the sporting style does not offer.
    What type of TKD does include lower body striking?

    Leave a comment:


  • Damian Mavis
    replied
    ITF TKD is 50% hands and that means to the head and face. A good ITF school does work hands sufficiently and their fighters are good at defending from them and using them. WTF of course does not, but those are 2 different styles, just don't think of all TKD as the same.

    Spetnatz, you are absolutely right about TKD 'ists not knowing how to execute and defend leg kicks, that was my biggest weakness when I started muay thai 6 years ago.... 7 years? Damn Im getting old and losing track of time haha. However I dont think muay thai is a more complete kicking art based on the practice of leg kicks... it is the same kick to three levels..... Muay thai fighters have a huge weakness for some kicking angles of attack from TKD because they too do not defend all the angles and therefore dont have a reflex reaction or counter for them. I'm not just saying this out of wishful thinking like alot of posters... I've sparred a lot of pro fighters in Thailand and noticed the same things over and over. Doesnt mean a pro couldnt kick my butt, just that they get caught by the same trick angles almost every time. If you keep using the same trick though... a good pro learns and adapts quick enough to take advantage of it before the end of the fight... so the moral of the story is you better knock him out before he learns or dont over use the same new angles.

    And... a good TKD school should be teaching leg kicks of various types as self defence at the least. But practicing how to kick the leg as self defence doesnt make it ingrained refex and there is rarely ay trainig to defend from the leg kick so absolutely no reflex for that at all.

    Damian Mavis
    Honour TKD thailand

    Leave a comment:


  • kuk sool won
    replied
    Originally posted by spetnatz View Post
    Taekwondo may be a good upper body kicking art but is certainly not a full body kicking art. The lower half of the body is excluded from taekwondo kicking practice, so TKD people don´t know how to deliver or deal with low kicks. As they also not practice much delivering and dealing with punches, they are left with an art that is almost only made of upper body kicking techniques. TKD may be renowned for its kicks but is certainly not a complete kicking art. Muay Thai has fewer kicking techniques but they cover the entire human body, from the head to the feet.
    Entirely depends on what type of TKD you are talking about. Yes, sporting TKD only includes upper body striking but there are so many aspects of TKD that the sporting style does not offer.

    Leave a comment:


  • spetnatz
    replied
    Taekwondo may be a good upper body kicking art but is certainly not a full body kicking art. The lower half of the body is excluded from taekwondo kicking practice, so TKD people don´t know how to deliver or deal with low kicks. As they also not practice much delivering and dealing with punches, they are left with an art that is almost only made of upper body kicking techniques. TKD may be renowned for its kicks but is certainly not a complete kicking art. Muay Thai has fewer kicking techniques but they cover the entire human body, from the head to the feet.

    Leave a comment:


  • kuk sool won
    replied
    i think boxing has the best kicks, you never expect them.

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  • aku aku
    replied
    Originally posted by B.Y.O.B.
    What is the most effective kicking art? And why?

    Well I say Capoeira, cause it has the advantage in the ground n can easily hit in the mid-section n the head.

    P.S. Im not tkdperson89.
    I kind of like savate. They do a good job combining hands and feet and they have a good mix of high, middle and low kicks. I like the way they use angles a lot and their use of the shoe makes sense in a self-defense environment.

    Leave a comment:

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