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CMA in reality vs. UFC rules

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  • CMA in reality vs. UFC rules

    this post is dedicated to all the UFC wannabes, so there

    UFC rules, as approved by the Nevada State Athletic Commission – July 23, 2001

    Weight classes:

    Lightweight – over 145 lbs. to 155 lbs.
    Welterweight – over 155 lbs. to 170 lbs.
    Middleweight – over 170 lbs. to 185 lbs.
    Light Heavyweight – over 185 lbs. to 205 lbs.
    Heavyweight – over 205 lbs. to 265 lbs.
    Bout duration:

    All non-championship bouts shall be three rounds.
    All championship bouts shall be five rounds.
    Rounds will be five minutes in duration, with a one minute.
    A one-minute rest period will occur between each round

    Butting with the head.
    Eye gouging of any kind. (this prohibits any kind of advanced eye gouging techniques found in most Chinese styles)
    Hair pulling. (again prohibits some of the most lethal techniques such as twisting or breaking the neck)
    Fish hooking. (prohibits many effective eagle and tiger claw techniques)
    Groin attacks of any kind. (prohibits many effective testicle kicks found in karate and kung fu)
    Putting a finger into any orifice or into any cut or laceration on an opponent.
    Small joint manipulation. (prohibits a vast array of chin na techniques)
    Striking to the spine or the back of the head.
    Striking downward using the point of the elbow.
    Throat strikes of any kind, including, without limitation, grabbing the trachea. (again, this prohibits a large number of techniques, some of which are very important in Chinese martial arts, such as the fok sau of wing chun, or the eagle claw techniques used on the throat)
    Clawing, pinching or twisting the flesh. (this would render most tiger and eagle claw styles useless)
    Grabbing the clavicle. (a very effective chin na technique)
    Kicking the head of a grounded opponent.
    Kneeing the head of a grounded opponent.
    Stomping a grounded opponent.
    Kicking to the kidney with the heel.
    Spiking an opponent to the canvas on his head or neck.
    Throwing an opponent out of the ring or fenced area.
    Holding the shorts or gloves of an opponent.
    Spitting at an opponent.
    Engaging in an unsportsmanlike conduct that causes an injury to an opponent.
    Holding the ropes or the fence.
    Using abusive language in the ring or fenced area.
    Attacking an opponent on or during the break.
    Attacking an opponent who is under the care of the referee.
    Attacking an opponent after the bell has sounded the end of the period of unarmed combat.
    Flagrantly disregarding the instructions of the referee.
    Timidity, including, without limitation, avoiding contact with an opponent, intentionally or consistently dropping the mouthpiece or faking an injury.
    Interference by the corner.
    Throwing in the towel during competition.
    Ways to win:

    Submission by:
    Physical tap out.
    Verbal tap out.
    Technical knockout by the referee stopping the contest.
    Decision via the scorecards, including:
    Unanimous decision.
    Split decision.
    Majority decision.
    Draw, including:
    Unanimous draw.
    Majority draw.
    Split draw.
    Technical decision.
    Technical draw.
    No contest.

    As you can see by looking thru the above, half the techniques that are found in traditional martial arts are prohibited, not because they do not work, but because they are too effective in damaging the opponent and removing his ability to fight, often causing permanent or at least crippling injury. Despite all this, UFC related styles are sold as “real fighting” and traditional styles are mocked and viewed as systems containing mostly useless techniques. The fact that many traditional styles lost in these tournaments makes things worse, leading high school wrestlers to believe they could beat any black belt. Yet how can you expect a fighter to win when the focus of his martial art is almost completely prohibited.
    So, as far as I’m concerned, the traditional arts of China remain the more reality based fighting art...

  • #2
    well said but wouldnt u get ur but whooped by his homies if u rip his nutsac off?


    • #3

      well, on the street you might be facing someone with a potentially vast skill difference than someone in the UFC. Someone who might not be as physically strong and fast as Vitor Belfort, but who will be equally determined in kicking you in the jimmy, throwing non-stop haymakers and trying to slam you into the ground or a wall and bang your head into it.

      If you're skilled enough to capture the kick and pull the rug out from under him or sweep him onto the ground, then why would you need small circle joint manipulation. Haymakers don't have knock out power, unless the guy is putting his weight into it; even then you have a huge window of time to do stuff.

      Hey, I think chin na is good stuff, but its the icing on the cake. You really need timing, conditioing, toughness and speed that comes from a good fighting style whether it be muay thai or silat.


      • #4
        Well said Tom, but Chin Na is not the only thing lost by UFC Rules. The UFC is mainly an entertainment/moneymaking arena. There is no way to determine the true combat ability of any of the fighters. This doesnt mean the chinese arts are better, but it does make it impossible to know either way. So I guess thats that, we'll never know, the rest is just opinion and conjecture. How many posts will it take to arrive where we started, everyone nursing their own opinions. This topic cannot be resolved under the current conditions of the UFC.


        • #5
          Originally posted by Studiobuddy
          well said but wouldnt u get ur but whooped by his homies if u rip his nutsac off?
          yes I probably would s'buddy, but then, if your asking me, I'm a guy that got his butt kicked badly the other day by a wasp

          *HuSanYan wanders back down the hill to nurse and comfort his poor delicate little skin from the nasty waspy*


          • #6
            Delete Delete


            • #7
              Delete Delete


              • #8
                Originally posted by Quiet Cool
                There is no way to determine the true combat ability of any of the fighters. This doesnt mean the chinese arts are better, but it does make it impossible to know either way.
                I disagree.

                The UFC is pretty close. Close enough to allow fighters to engage in combat and eventually come back for more competition, which is closest to any other competition except....

                the dog brothers comp, which allows for sticks, kicking, punching, throwing and grappling.


                • #9
                  some very good points darrianation.


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by darrianation
                    ...and really begin to cross train in boxing, Muay Thai, BJJ, and etc.
                    Dude, your argument just went out the window. Why the HELL would you need to train in another striking art? Just train properly and quit dabbling, if all you do is dabble you're going to be really shitty at a bunch of systems, instead of good in one system.


                    • #11
                      The UFC is realistic but not real. People don't pull out knives or there friends do not jump in. It provides a safe enviroment for people to test there skills though. But I would not make the mistake of considering it the same as what works in a street fight or the training is for the street. There is more stuff involved for training for the street. A muay thai guy would do better in a fight with multiples than a bjj guy and excetra. But the UFC has shown us several things. It has shown us that we should not drop into a deep horse stance and try to trade blows from there. It has shown us we should not let out blood curling screams and attempt to hit our opponent with a flying spinning back kick.


                      • #12
                        Delete Delete


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by AlexJitsu
                          dude, dude, dude, dude, dude, dude


                          • #14
                            I have to admit that reading Darrianation's well thought out arguments on various things have caused me to rethink some of my positions. When I was a kid I used to get in a lot of fights because I had a bad temper. I didn't know what I was doing, but the only times I sometimes lost were to kids who were older and bigger than me. I guess I was too stupid to factor that in.

                            Since I began studying martial arts, I've only been in one minor skirmish, and that ended quickly. I study martial arts strickly for self defense, and not competition. If I'm going to do something nasty, it will be because it is absolutely necessary and not because of some game I am playing.

                            Do you really want to see groins and throats ripped in a competition? How about eyes being gouged? Let the competition guys do their thing. These guys are in such great shape and so good, that their skills will serve them well in a great many street situations, especially if they use common sense. Any intellectually honest BJJ guy knows that the ground is not a good place to be when the opponent has friends or a girlfriend. He knows that while he has someone in a submissions hold the girlfriend could be sticking a knife in his ribs or other area. MMA guys who love competition know the rules and stick by them. When I watch football, I watch the linemen a lot because that is what I played in school. I don't think that the rules are stupid and that I could be an NFL lineman if there were no rules. I could take the position that I could do well in the NFL by wasting the DL with a 12 gauge buckshot blast to clear the #3 hole for our back. But with no rules, the linebacker could knife slash the running back in the leg. I still enjoy football and don't wish they would do away with the rules. Martial arts competition is the same. Let them have rules and we'll keep the "no rules" option for street survival.

                            I've always appreciated great fighters. I loved Muhammad Ali as a great boxer, and never thought that he would do well against a couple of street thugs. How a competition fighter does in the ring is what is important. I am happy to leave the elbow breaks, and throat rips for life and death situations, and let the competition guys do their thing. There is something in the martial arts for everyone and room for what everyone gets off on.


                            • #15
                              You fail to address the central point - in early days the UFC allowed just about anything. Your super Kung Fu Gods acheived jack shit.

                              Maybe they weren't trained in the secret, closed door, methods.......