Bruce Lee's Size.

[Thai Bri]

Yeah yeah yeah. These guys are all so tough because they are so big.

Like Bruce Lee.......

Contradicting yourself, little guy?

[WaTEr]

HA HA HA you got him...

[Makaveli_786]

Toughness comes through muscle. Most bodybuilders carry less muscle per ounce than Bruce Lee genius.

[chris davis 200]

toughness comes through muscle - hmm - dunno about that!

[Pencode]

Hello there

Seems to be a lot of arguing here. Strange, I thought this a place for discussion. Apparently many of you are young so you didn't experience the "era of Bruce Lee". I saw Bruce twice in Long Beach. I was about twenty at the time. He showed us things unheard of at the time and if it were not for him, who knows where the martial arts would be now.

When you say Rickson or so and so would kick Bruce's ass, you are forgetting a few things. Let me give a few examples of what I mean. When I first saw Bruce I laughed. "what the heck is this skinny ass som bitch gonna do?" He was a short scrawny little guy....looked like Ethiopian of the year(chinese version). However, after his demo, I was flabergasted. He called people out of the audience,mostly martial artists, and told them "I am going to punch you in the face, block it if you can". Wham, wham, wham, no matter how many times he punched not a single one of them could block it. Another person he told " I am going to throw a finger jab at your eyes... stop me". We found out later that not only did he jab past the guys guard, but he also closed his eyelids gently with the tips of his fingers before the guy could even blink. That is what I call accuracy. Next he called a big guy out. The guy was about six feet 240- 250 pounds. He put this pad to the guys chest and told him to hold it. Then he started rambling on about how the typical karateka threw a punch and showed us. Then he walked up to the guy put his fist about six inches away and punched, knocking the guy back into a chair that was behind him. Thats a lot of power for a skinny dude. I also witnessed him kick and break I believe it was four out of five boards that were dangling....DANGLING, no one holding them stiff and solid. I was fired up after that. I tried to kick one dangling board and it just kept flying across the room. Pissed off, I took a hammer and hit it and still didn't break it. How could one little guy generate sooo much power? I also remember him have one of the other martial artists throw punches at him whever he wanted. The guy could not hit him. He would slip and throw a quick kick to the groin, he deflected a few with a sliding finger jabs to the eyes.

I don't know if guys like Rickson could handle this kind of person. I mean think about it. Rickson would try to come in or shoot and wham, a figer jab to the eyes before he could even see it coming or shin kick so fast and powerful it would just stop him in his tracks. In fact I remember an interview with Chuck Norris not too long after the Ed Parker event where he said that he thought Bruce had esp because no matter what he did or threw at him, Bruce countered with ease. He said Bruce would hit him before he moved or was about to move almost like he could predict what was coming next and that he was so fast that he could not stop him from hitting him(of course later on to save face his whole opinion changed). Then again all three of the karate champs at that time had begun studying under Bruce and strangely enough , all three became champs. Hmmmm... that's peculiar. In fact, all three of them after the tournament attributed their wins to Bruces training and then later turned on him. Chuck, Joe Lewis and I forget the third fellas name. But I do remember Joe and Chuck both disrespecting Bruce after he died...sad, very sad.

There was so much information on Bruce at the time. Recordings of the '64 and I believe '69 Ed Parker events...Black Belt magazine interviews...tons of paperback books and on and on. Bruce sparred with a lot of people back then. Usually top people from their respective arts. His best friend was judo champ at the time(I forget his name). Guys from ju jitsu, aikido, karate, kung fu, wrestling and boxing sparred with him and every single one thought he was not human. There were even two stuntmen...American if I remember correctly...who swore up and down that Bruce kicked a door off the hinges and took the one stuntguy standing behind it with it. What more do you need to prove your martial art prowess? Kill someone before you are considered to be good? Doesn't make sense. You guys argue over who was the best martial artist of the 20th century and it is silly. I can tell you who was the most influential, who changed the face of martial art and it's way of thinking. But how can you compare a Gracie or any other to Bruce?

I look at it this way. I am a 59yr old man and have seen a lot. Been through Korea and Vietnam. Have seen things come and go and then come again... just like the Brazilian Ju-Jitsu thing going on right now. Some one came along and opened their eyes. Actually, just reminded them of the things that were forgotten long ago when men got into stand up only and forgot about grappling.

The other thing, Bruces size. Of course he was small in stature because of his Asian ancestry. However, it was his power(even when he lost all that weight for Game of Death) that was mind boggling. As an example, look at your typical Olympic weightlifter. They are some of the most powerful individuals on the planet. Yet they don't have that overdone lumpiness of a bodybuider. In fact, some of them are flyweights and can move tremendous amounts of weight. I have seen little 5'4'' weightlifters dunk a basketball with two hands with out a running start. It just the amount of power (speed times strength) they can generate without all that muscular size. Same as Bruce, tenuos strength not muscular strength.
I appologize for the long post but when you get a 60 year old going sometimes we just ramble on and on.

[Makaveli_786]

Well said.

My grandad actually sparred with Bruce Lee once, and Ive also seen a video version of the 1 inch punch... now that is RAW POWER, real raw amazing power.

A lot of martial artists break wood with theyr hands to show how much power they have amongst other things. One of the hardest trees is a redwood. Bruce Lee got a starring role for(it was a program I can't recall at this time but ill get a name after this meeting). Anyway they coat some redwood, wood with some oakwood to make sure its really really hard and mold some special pastic onto it. The way the mixture is compiled its virtually indestructuble and looks beautiful. This stuff is harder than steel in most cases. Anyway they told Bruce Lee to get down the stairs as fast as he possible could, Brue ran half way down the stairs, kicked part of the stair case, broke it and slid down a pole. Now considering it was one kick that broke a steel like structure, that my friends is what you POWER!!!

[Thai Bri]

Demos and sparring, and more than a few myths.....

Sure he was an outstanding Martial Artist, but the question of "who did he fight" remains.

[akja]

Originally posted by Thai Bri
Demos and sparring, and more than a few myths.....

Sure he was an outstanding Martial Artist, but the question of "who did he fight" remains.

Did you change your name from Bri Thai?

[WaTEr]

To tell you and hopefully prove i know the bruce lee era, the show was called green hornet. Did you know? that black belt magazine are the ones that made bruce lee aunthentic. For this bruce lee was in deep grattitude for what they did. did you also know? that everytime someone came to bruce about publishing a new way to do a technique, he always bruce lee told them to go to black belt, he alwasy thought they were the best.

[RobertG]

Originally posted by WaTEr
"good footwork can beat any kick or punch" i'd like to see the hulkster touch me that big oaf! i thinks that how i spell it...?

I see a lot of ridiculous things on this website. Everyday I usually find something far stupider than the day before. Today did not disappoint. A 16 year old kid calling out the Hulkster.

Ok, so Hulk is about 6'7" or 6'8". He's somewhere between 280 and 300 pounds, probably just under 10% bodyfat when he's in top condition. He is a professional athelete. Wrestling may be fake these days, I'll grant that. But those guys are real atheletes. They really can wrestle and they really are badasses. This is not open to debate. Most humans simply cannot endure the rigours of professional wrestling. So we're talking about a superbly conditioned athelete who has been wrestling since the 70s (before, I might add, the "sport" became a total joke insofar as outcomes are concerned). If memory serves me, Hulk could lift Andre the Giant over his head and throw him. Andre was somewhere in the vicinity of 500 pounds. Very few humans are capable of lifting 500 pounds over their head and throwing it--even fewer could perform that feat and proceed to continue wrestling.

The notion of any 16 year old kid taking out Hulk Hogan is absurd. Its more absurd that firing ki fireballs from your hands. I mean I suppose you could be preternaturally gifted and be some genetic freak and built like Shaquille O'Neal at 16. Of course, if this were the case you'd be in the NBA summer league or NFL training camp or somesuch and not posting on this board. Kids with those genetics don't post on this website. Without those genetics you do not stand a chance of doing anything other than running away from Hulk Hogan, or any other professional wrestler, male or female. Most of these guys are on steroids, not to mention painkillers, so they possess strength the likes of which you want no part of, and a tolerance for far more pain than you could possibly dish out.

Now as for this Bruce mythology---why do we need to have a superhuman Bruce? Bruce was also a genetic freak--he had incredible speed and agility and strength. But he wasn't superhuman. People are making him sound like he's the hardest hitter of all time. I am very skeptical Bruce hit any harder than a top notch professional boxer of equivalent size. I am skeptical Bruce could kick any harder than a professional Thai boxer of equivalent size. I am skeptical Bruce could dominate a top notch grappler on the ground (assuming we start only on the ground). These are reasonable things to be skeptical about. The guy had amazing ability. He did a tremendous amount for the martial arts. And he made some good movies. But he was not a superhero. Lets look at some facts shall we? It is a fact that there are more people doing martial arts now than when Bruce was becoming popular here. That means there is a larger genetic pool to draw from. That means that we should expect to see people of Bruce's ability--e.g. he was not a once in the lifetime of the universe event. There is much more media coverage of martial arts these days, more magazines, websites and all that. Thus, if other people were capable of the amazing feats attributed to Bruce, we'd hear about them. Training methods in martial arts are better now (thanks, perhaps, in part to Bruce). Nutrition is better. Conditioning methods are better. People cross-train a lot more (again, thanks to Bruce). So, we have potentially more people with Bruce's raw genetic skill. These people have access to better nutrition and training methods than Bruce. They have access to more martial arts knowledge than Bruce did (that is through the above mentioned media). And there are more professional martial artists now (Bruce was a professional actor--that is, he spent a good portion of his adult life doing television and movies, albeit he trained a lot). There is a good deal of money to be made in fighting if you have skills like Bruce. So if we examine all these facts and look out upon the world of martial arts, we find there are no people with the alleged skills of Bruce. This is rather curious. Are we to believe that unlike any other endeavor where top notch talent remerges every generation, martial arts is unique. There was one god of martial arts and now no one will ever compare. Doubtful. The fact is that today's professional boxers, kickboxers, and mixed martial artists are probably among the best that have ever been. Because of the affluence of modern civilization and all the above advances, these people are as good as it gets. I really hate to break it to all of you. Yes, when you watch Pride or UFC that's pretty much as good as people can fight. Sure, there are a handful of people that don't fight professionally that could beat these people. But to claim that Bruce could walk into the professional arena today and just totally destroy everyone in any weight division is absurd and defies logic. Given today's training and nutrition and given that he dedicated himself to fighting and not making movies, I will grant that its likely Bruce would be a champion mixed martial artist, boxer or kickboxer IN HIS WEIGHT DIVISION. He might well be able to beat guys in other divisions. But like every champion he would loose on occassion. And for all his skill, speed and power its totally unlikely that he'd be stepping into the ring with heavyweight boxers and take the heavyweight boxing title at 150 pounds. Although I'd give him a much better chance than Water beating Hulk Hogan.

[WaTEr]

oh my oh my you've gone senial. i stand by more words forever till death due us part. 'good footwork can beat any kcik or punch" and so be it, i believe my footwork is exceptional. you might possibly say i have fancy footwork if you want to take it that far. as a younger one age 12 or so i dabbled in the onsetting glow of martial arts. i began with a basic footwork move called the shuffle. i practiced till hearts content on getting good footwork because i belived "good footwork can beat any kick or punch" i moved onto the quick advance which is similar to the shuffle. the quick retreat which mocks the quick advance is the same but opposite. Over the years i developed good enough coordination to learn the burst. For such an inferior creature like hulk hogan, i'd used a burst into a sidekick, obviously i'd be able to attack first due to my speed greater then his. i'd get him good in the ribs and break them and he'd go home crying. if the one kick did'nt work. i'd repeat the shot after a while. his peanut brain would probably try to bear hug me but i'd finally take him out with a shot to the jewels. i win!!!!!!! !!!

[Pencode]

Hmmm, more arguing?

From what I have gathered, there seems to be a misconception here. People are trying to compare Bruce to wrestlers and professional fighters. However, that is an impossible feat. Like saying which is better, apples or oranges. Bruce was all about self defense, scoring at any cost, whereas, profesionals fight in a ring with a preset agenda(rules). Bruce's theory was anhialate an opponent before he can do you harm. In the ring and training to fight in the ring are completely different than training to maim or kill someone and survival in life and death situations.

When I first saw Ultimate Fighting I was overjoyed. "Finally some REAL fighting"... until I saw a guy disqualified for kneeing an opponent while on all fours. WHAT!!! This is not ULTIMATE fighting. Utimate fighters were gladiators...life or death...if you survived a number of fights sometimes you were given your freedom. Ultimate incentive. Samuria and Ninja...life or death. Filipino Escrimadors beat off the Spanish without guns. Our modern day gladiators have no life or death incentive just rules that cannot be violated. Of course Bruce would not enter a ring with an Ali or otherwise. His fighting art was about NO RULES not about putting on gloves and not hitting below the waist and such, not about no hitting the eyes or throat or groin area. A truly ultimate fighter knows every way to damage the human body. You guys who have been in 'Nam know what I mean. I witnessed guys who thought they would just overpower those little F.......... Well, I mean, next thing you know the guy's screaming because his eyes were gouged out of his head. You learn quick.

Young people always assume that they will just kick someone's ass with muscle. Us older guys know better. While you are swinging away we will just kick you in the balls. You think because Hulk Hogan is huge and powerful that he cannot be beaten. Just imagine a crazed maniac running full blast at him, jumping up on him and ripping the eyes out of his head without warning. Oh, that's right young'ons. You can't put muscles on eyeballs...OOPs. With age comes wisdom. You learn to fight smarter not harder. Now on the same token get in the ring and try to overpower the Hulkster, he will beat the living crap out of you...probably beat you to death. That is the difference between guys in the ring and a guy like Bruce. Smart fighting. Where can I hit you that you have no defense against? Will I or can I do ANYTHING to win? Not so in UFC. Let a guy like Tank bite someone's nose off. Instant disqualification...why? because it is against the...RULES. Did the other guy expect it? of course not because he fights within the parameters of UFC rules. If Bruce fought Ali in the ring without rules or gloves would Ali expect kicks in the legs? of course not.

I read somewhere,"Yes, when you watch Pride or UFC that's pretty much as good as people can fight." Not true. Let men fight without rules in an arena and then you will witness how well a man can fight. You will then see with your own eyes the atrocities that the human mind can develop. Rules are meant for the ring. Real fighting is reality in the really real world where life or death are the rules.

[Makaveli_786]

Ive seen arm wrestling on TV and arm wrestling in prison. The guys on TV have big muscle and shet and they put on a good show but in prison theres blood all over their damn face.

They dont show that on TV now do they?

Theres always rules to what they can show you on TV and they cant go beyond a certain barrier so I agree with pencode... you cant show your ultimate on TV.

Also Hulk Hogan has gone beyond many pain barriers... Poking him in the eyes and hitting him in the balls is a good strategy but how long do you honestly think it could keep that monster on his knees?

[Paul Wilson]

So does anyone agree with me about the somatotypes?

Bruce was an ectomorph. Not an extreme ectomorph.
But his does not mean he did not pack a powerful punch. Ask Makaveli he's grandad sparred with Bruce.That more than I can say. I have no relatives who have met him.

[WaTEr]

Paul your absloutely right, i award you 200pts for actually talking about the topic.