Mixed Martial Arts, One of the oldest forms of fighting.

[knifethrower]

You said you chose your words with care. Now, I'm choosing these words with equal care. You are sticking your nose into other people's business - namely mine. I would sincerely like for you to drop it and not bring it up anymore. Especially if the only person you're going to cast blame at is me. I don't want to hear another thing about it from you. Please stop. I need no apology or explanation, no further clarification on your motives, and no expansion on your points. I do not want your take on Boar's side of it either. I will delete any and all posts that attempt any of these things.

Not that I want this message deleted or anything but, why delete?

[BoarSpear]

[Tom Yum]

sorry if you felt i was bashing you for your beliefs, i know i come off kind of harsh sometimes, but i don't mean any ill will by it.

I'm not offended nor bothered, but I appreciate your good will.

[DickHardman]

We get accused and debated every day. Hell I got bashed by DickHardman, Tree, Garland and some invisible posters for sticking up for my beliefs, but in the end most of us still get along - even though the debates still heat up now and then.

sorry if you felt i was bashing you for your beliefs, i know i come off kind of harsh sometimes, but i don't mean any ill will by it.

if you ever come to cali, let me know and ill blaze you out real proper, and ill even burn you a copy of my favorite dvd, "Virtual Sex with Teagan Presley".

[jubaji]

I suppose you could cry about it then

I think you've already covered that.

[Sagacious Lu]

And I'm kind of sick of hearing you be sick about it.

I suppose you could cry about it then

[jubaji]

STFU begins at home

this this is happening on a public forum and I'm sick of hearing about it.

And I'm kind of sick of hearing you be sick about it.

[Tom Yum]

PMs were posted at the time, maybe there were some that weren't, I don't know. I really don't want to start poking my nose too far into other people's business but this this is happening on a public forum and I'm sick of hearing about it. The topic has been coming up repeatedly without my in put or I wouldn't be piping up now.

Lu, if you see something you dislike, you can switch over to another page. I find myself doing that alot.

I really think you're making a much bigger deal out of it than it needs to be, but of course in the end that's your perogative. I wouldn't have spoken up now except that YOU just attacked MY integrity by questioning whether I really train regularly.

Yeah, but you got sharp with Mike while Mike (and Boar) have been getting along, maybe not friends (yet), but hey they're occupying the same space and even participating in neigboring topics. Its not helping the greater good - both guys contributing different sides on interesting topics.

I don't appreciate it now any more than you did then. I'd honestly rather forgive, forget and just let it drop here- and I hope everyone else will too. I chose my words extremely carefully; I didn't respond to your insult until a day later because frankly I was pissed off and I didn't want to say something I'd regret later. I was most definately going to say something though. Hopefully you can respect this much because I genuinely enjoy talking to you on here.

Its just the web, man.

We get accused and debated every day. Hell I got bashed by DickHardman, Tree, Garland and some invisible posters for sticking up for my beliefs, but in the end most of us still get along - even though the debates still heat up now and then.

[knifethrower]

Was I quiet?

Ya had to be to defend yourself against all those damn ninja

http://www.defend.net/deluxeforums/showthread.php?t=22495&page=2

[Sagacious Lu]

Lu,
I appreciate the input. I do. But you don't know what was said. You didn't read the PM's, the direct insults specifically calling my character and integrity into question expressly because I supported MMA, or the six or seven unacknowledged apologies I made when all that was going on. Since you brought it up, that needs to be said as well. And while we're talking about the definition of character, I feel it's what defines me, and I cannot abide by someone slandering that because I stand by a well-earned opinion. I feel a friend would understand that, and would pick something other than my character to assault if they disagree with me.

I don't hold any grudge toward Boar, and I've said that. Really, I don't hold a grudge against anyone. He knows where things stand, he read my apologies at the time, and he chose his own answer to them. I can respect that, even if I don't call him friend anymore. As for your input, it's well-heeded. But I will caution you not to think you know things that you were not party to, and if you truly believe it's an issue that should be laid to rest, stop piping up about it.

PMs were posted at the time, maybe there were some that weren't, I don't know. I really don't want to start poking my nose too far into other people's business but this this is happening on a public forum and I'm sick of hearing about it. The topic has been coming up repeatedly without my in put or I wouldn't be piping up now. I really think you're making a much bigger deal out of it than it needs to be, but of course in the end that's your perogative. I wouldn't have spoken up now except that YOU just attacked MY integrity by questioning whether I really train regularly. I don't appreciate it now any more than you did then. I'd honestly rather forgive, forget and just let it drop here- and I hope everyone else will too. I chose my words extremely carefully; I didn't respond to your insult until a day later because frankly I was pissed off and I didn't want to say something I'd regret later. I was most definately going to say something though. Hopefully you can respect this much because I genuinely enjoy talking to you on here.

[Tom Yum]

I write that MMA fighters are not even the best kickboxers, and here comes Dick saying that kickboxers would kick so and so's ass. You're not kickboxers, remember? You're MMA. You're not BJJ players. You're MMA. You're not boxers. You're MMA. You don't punch, kick or grapple as well TMA's do.

Uke, there are a few MMA guys who started off in MMA who can punch, kick and grapple as well as TMA's can. I'm thinking off guys like Frank Shamrock and Vitor Belfort (allbeit Belfort was something of a golden gloves boxer while learning BJJ).

Other fighters know who they are. Only MMA's thing that they can venture outside on MMA events and still succeed even though the skill level is higher in K-1, Abu Dhabi and professional boxing.

They can succeed oustide of MMA events.

And just so you know, you're statement concerning Couture rising to the top in any MA is ridiculous. He's a great wrestler. But put him in K-1, a boxing ring or in the Abu Dhabi and he would get knocked out just like 90% of MMA fighters who venture out do.

There are some who've made the journey into other arts and were very successful:

Khaosay Galaxy - went from top-level muay thai fighter, to undefeated? in western boxing.

Lucia Rijker - same thing.

[IPON]

And now back to the topic

It is very easy to put every MA under the philosophical umbrella of MMA. But it is not true to look at other arts and think they are an extension of JKD or assuming that a combination styles are MMA...it isn't. There are some very high caliber MAs that are in MMA, but realistically it’s Mixed Martial Techniques (not arts). All MA styles have adapted changed over the centuries and included elements from other styles. But I think some of the problem is there are people that will train 6 months of 3-5 styles and have an opinion (negative) This sucks or worse (positive) I study BJJ, and MT and now I'm ready. This I believe is happening more frequently. Generally, MMA is BJJ, MT (wrestling/Boxing) but really is could be anything. It is trained a sport to be a sport. Can it be used outside the ring, yes as can all fighting sports. Can a MMA fighter walking out of an elevator beat a TMA guy I would hope so because of the conditioning, but I wouldn’t assume so. If I was the TMA guy I would take the bet. And If one of you was the TMA guy you should as well or just stop training now because you are wasting your time and money. So to answer the question is MMA is a sport fighting format of some standing and grappling, but not a style or art by itself. It would be too simplistic to compare MMA and earlier pankration in that context. It would be like saying all red round fruit are apples when many are pomegranates (high anti oxidants btw).

Ok my 2 cents let the criticism begin

[BoarSpear]

At the same time, I am glad that Boar is back and that Mike and Boar seem to be getting along.

Kissenger ain't got shit on Tom Yum.

[Sagacious Lu]

[QUOTE]

You can't isolate this from the rest of what Mike's done for the forum.

Actually Tom, I like the guy quite a bit, but what I posted needed to be said.

[Tom Yum]

I definately don't hold grudges against my friends for months after the fact just because they lost their temper and put their foot in their mouth on the internet.

No, but controlling one's temper is a start for everyone.

Does this post belong here or would it be more on topic in your thread on the definition of character?

You can't isolate this from the rest of what Mike's done for the forum.

Overall, he's kept the environment friendly enough for people to discuss various MA, self-defense topics and much more.

Mike's done a helluva job moderating. He kicks out trolls and bullies, both which are not constructive for any environment. Do you agree, Lu?

Yeah, it sucks that Mike and Boar had a falling out. At the same time, I am glad that Boar is back and that Mike and Boar seem to be getting along.