??? re Greg Alland tapes...

[Kali Novice]

First off, thank you for taking the time to answer my questions. I was sincerely hoping that because this board is full of people who are so diverse and experienced that I could get intellegent and informed answers.

If people want to blend systems fine. More power to them. As long as they have the permission for the grandmaster of that system.

. . . .

But, he insists that if I wish to learn his entire family system, not to blend them and teach it that way. I don't think that is too much to ask. It Is THE Tortal family treasure.

While I understand the Tortal 'family treasure' holds a great deal of meaning on a number of levels, including but not limited to cultural, religeous and familial, it's not something that can be lost because it's shared, is it?
It makes sense if he wishes to teach that style alone, but because it is such a fine and complete system, isn't it a good thing that other martial artists are taking these practices and incoorperating them into their own training?

While Dekiti-Tersia Siradas is a full combat system, the sheer amount of experience and interest in other styles by the people on this board leads me to make the assumption that there's an agreement to the benefits of practicing other styles. It's never a good idea to make assumptions, I know, but isn't it always better to have a little more in your arsenal? Of course, I could be missing something; I have no place to be discussing the deeper levels of the martial arts.

Having said that, I was lead to understand that Greg is no longer calling the style he teaches Dekiti-Tersia Siradas. Are the politics around Mr.Alland based on the use of the Tortal fame to spread his own system, which would seem not to be a problem if it is true that he is no longer calling his style DTS, or are they pertaining to the fact that he is blending them at all in his teachings?

Terribly sorry to preach, but if it is the blending in itself, I fail to understand the crime and almost have the gall to applaud him for teaching a blend; Fillipino Martial Arts are relatively unknown to such a vast number of people here in the United States that there is little opportunity to learn the styles seperately. I don't know the situation in other countries, and because Greg teaches all over the world, I suppose that's a rather sorry argument on which to base an opinion on his actions, though....

Of course, it is possible that I was misinformed about Greg's re-naming of his system. If such is the case, I hope that those more affiliated within the FMA community can fill me in.

Thousand thanks, and pardon the rambling. I hope I haven't overstepped my boundaries, I should use less bold ways of expressing the points at which I'm confused, but that'd make these posts even longer!

[ruffstuff]

blending and offending

To whom it may concern,

For starters. The reason I engaged this for forum was to say that GM himself wants the negativity to stop. He is not only a true warrior that survived the Japanese during WWII. But more impostantly a very spiritual man. He does NOT approve of a student calling another childish names.

If people want to blend systems fine. More power to them. As long as they have the permission for the grandmaster of that system.

GM has given me his blessing to continue my studies in Harimau, Matjan, Kuntoa, Doce Pares, Bugua Zhang and Shuai-Chao. But, he insists that if I wish to learn his entire family system, not to blend them and teach it that way. I don't think that is too much to ask. It Is THE Tortal family treasure. I asked if I could learn Dumog and Panantukan while in the Philippine. He told me I was welcome to learn his boxing and wrestling as well as from other instructors.

As for evolution. Until people are able to strike you dead by thought process alone. Dekiti-Tersia Siradas pretty much has everything covered. The more I learn ,the more I realize DTS has everything. It is a full combat system. Punching, kicking, knees, elbows, thows, sweeps, locks, traps, deflections, destructions, groundfighting, reversals, knife, sword, stick, staff, spear. Need I go on? On a modern note. GM teaches the US and Philippine military close range combat. PR-24, batonet fighting, carbine and handgun disarms. He even teaches how to fight with your hands tied.

If you look hard enough, you'll find there are a very small handfull of systems that have everything you need. Everything was tought to GM by his family, not techniques from other styles.

And now for Kaliace and MA Mike. A few people are upset with Mike Olive for following the leader. He decided to learn diectly from GM tortal and a few people did not like that at all. Aan a few people are just taking sides. As for MA MIke, he should inquire a little before going off the deep end. But, I do have to say he has not had the chance to meet GM and get more information about the DTS system. That's NOT his fault. And for that I feel very bad for him and the other students in Germany. MA Mike is more than welcome to contact me at anytime and I will be more than willing to give him GM and Master Jerson Jr's contact information. Whatever he wants, Sandata, pictures, anything I can do just say the word.

God Bless, Mike Snow

[ruffstuff]

blending and offending

To whom it may concern,

For starters. The reason I engaged this for forum was to say that GM himself wants the negativity to stop. He is not only a true warrior that survived the Japanese during WWII. But more impostantly a very spiritual man. He does NOT appove of a student calling another childish names.

If people want to blend systems fine. More power to them. As long as they have the permission for the grandmaster of that system.

GM has given me his blessing to continue my studies in Harimau, Matjan, Kuntoa, Doce Pares, Bugua Zhang and Shuai-Chao. But, he insists that if I wish to learn his entire family system, not to blend and teach them that way. I don't think that is too much to ask. It Is THE Tortal family treasure. I asked if I could learn Dumog and Panantukan while in the Philippine. He told me I was welcome to learn his boxing and wrestling as well as from other instructors.

As for evolution. Until people are able to strike you dead by thought process alone. Dekiti-Tersia Siradas pretty much has everything covered. The more I learn ,the more I realize DTS has everything. It is a full combat system. Punching, kicking, knees, elbows, thows, sweeps, locks, traps, deflections, destructions, groundfighting, reversals, knife, sword, stick, staff, spear. Need I go on? On a modern note. GM teaches the US and Philippine military close range combat. PR-24, batonet fighting, carbine and handgun disarms. He even teaches how to fight with your hands tied.

If you look hard enough, you'll find there are a very small handfull of systems that have everything you need. All tought to GM by his family, not from other styles.

And now for Kaliacw and MA Mike. A few people are upset with Mike Olive for following the leader. He decided to learn diectly from GM tortal and a few people did not like that. A few people are just taking sides. As for MA MIke, he should inquire a little before going off the deep end. But, I do have to say he has not had the chance to meet GM and get more information about the DTS system. And for that I feel very bad for him and the other students in Germany. MA Mike is more than welcome to contact me at anytime and I will be more than willing to give him GM and Master Jerson Jr's contact information. Whatever he wants, Sandata, pictures, anything I can do just say the word.

God Bless, Mike Snow

[danjuandesiga]

but, what exactly is the issue with Greg over? Or rather, what is the purpose to the entire sequence of arguments between MA Mike and Kaliace?

It was about the tapes Greg Alland has on the market and what others have thought of them. Also about his legitimacy as a certified instructor in the Pekiti Tirsia system through Tuhon Leo Gaje Jr.

I personally think the tapes are crap. Other than that I know nothing else about the man.

Dan Juan de Siga

[Kali Novice]

Yo,

Sorry to be beating a dead horse due to a lack of other method to get anywhere (I also apologize for the horrid metaphore.), but, what exactly is the issue with Greg over? Or rather, what is the purpose to the entire sequence of arguments between MA Mike and Kaliace?

I'm obviously not connected into any of this, am a total greenhorn, and all of that, but if someone could explain why exactly Greg's blending of systems is considered to be such a crime, I'd greatly appreciate it. I can see why he shouldn't promote his own system and call it Tortall's just to promote himself, and I don't know if he does or not; but, why does the 'purity' of a system matter? Wouldn't it be a good thing to change and evolve a system? I suppose it could complicate matters, but if you get a blend of styles, can't you have a complex system with things that're easier to learn and use for certain types of people?

Like I said, I'm no one of any intellegence in these matters, but I'd like to be able to pass off my lack of understanding on an ignorance or lack of exposure and/or explination. Certainly don't intend to get into anything heated or testy, as things have seem to have done here.

[kaliace]

I have some video footage of this demo that clearly shows participation by Mr. Olive.

Grand Master and I were working the Long Stick. Needless to say he threw me around like I was a rag doll! It was a good time but on the hardwood….ouch!

Michael G Olive

[BB408]

Who arranged the Dekiti-Tersia Siradas demonstration at the 'Show Me State Games'? Michael G. Olive and Master Dexter.

I have some video footage of this demo that clearly shows participation by Mr. Olive.

[ruffstuff]

the truth

Hello everyone, Kamasta ka

It is true that the negativity has nearly climaxed. Hate to see it. This forum is like the shot heard around the world. Everyone wants the truth. The reason I got on here was to help clear the air, if I possibly can. After the slap in the face I got today.

Here goes...........

Questions about Matahari Tuhon 'Nene' Tortal's Tour.

Who organized it? Greg....

Who paid for the round trip tickets for GM and Master Jerson Jr.? I did!

Who paid for the flight tickets for GM's second(independent) tour? Michael G. Olive, Detective David Rice and myself.

Who arranged the Dekiti-Tersia Siradas demonstration at the 'Show Me State Games'? Michael G. Olive and Master Dexter.

Who arranged the meeting with GM 'Nene' and Guro Dan Inosanto?(the slap in the face)? I did, with the unselfish help of Brian Rideout of Rising Pheonix Martail Arts in Evansville, IN-USA. For whom I am very thankful.

I also want to publicly say thank you to Joel and Guro Dan for being so to kind and pleasant to us. The dinner was great too............. GM gave Guro Dan a Kampilan as a gift and the specially made Ginunting is being forged as we speak.

Is Dekiti-Tersia Siradas part of the Kali-Silat System? Only the first 12 basic attacts. Dekiti-Tersia Siradas has 5 seperate sets of the 12 basic attacts.
12 basic attacks with baston.
12 punyo attacks with baston.
12 thusting attacks with baston.
12 sac-sac attacks with blade
12 pacal attaks with blade
Even have a pac-sac blade system.

I was also with them during one of the trips to Washington D.C.. To visit the German the embassy(waisted trip). I have spent a total of 6 weeks with GM 'Nene' in the last 6 months. And yes, some of those weeks were very painful(but well worth it). GM's Dumog and Buno skills are awsome. I speak to Master Jerson Jr. nearly every night as well. And will be spending the holidays with them in Negros. My Point is, if anyone has any questoins. SHOOT! The negativity needs to STOP. If I do not know the answer, I will get it.
Talaam..............

God Bless, Mike Snow

[tigrtclaw]

Do we really have a fight?

Well now,This is all getting very interesting Ha Hah!
Anyone else want to see this?
Is Michael Olive going to mix it up with MA Mike on the card?

[VT3]

I said what I said! if Greg Alland or Tanner Dustin Etan or whatever his silly name is wants to step up then they can bring it. Theres no lame banter cause I'm all game. lets go bare handed with witnesses and roll the camera too!

[TopDog]

This stuff is really funny.
How do people get so upset over things and people that they hardly even know, or know about?

[tigrtclaw]

Lets get it on

So What's the news- :
Is there going to be any action, or just lame insults and reckless banter thrown around?



VT3 Are you going to step up?

[danjuandesiga]

Bring it, don't just sing it

If there is a match going on, don't forget to tape it.
Screw the credentials and what the paper says.
Be real and back the smack with some ACTION

DanJuandeSiga

[TopDog]

VT3 what are your credentials?

VT3, Those are Very Brash statements indeed.
So What makes you think that you can beat Greg Alland, let alone Tanner, who fought professionally as a kickboxer. I heard that Tanner is very well accustomed to accepting challenges.

[tigrtclaw]

VT3 Wants to test Alland

What was that VT3?

Are you actually issuing out a challenge out to fight Greg Alland and/or David Tanner?

(With Sticks, empty hands or what?)