Medival Knight VS Japanese Samauri (sp)

[Sensei Saki]

A place we call "reality."When was this exactly?

[Tant01]

Wha....?

Not sure where your info came from but its wrong. Jui jitsu was developed a long time ago. Akido was developed from it, it was called aiki jui jitsu before the 40's. But I think morihei started the development of his unarmed fighting in the 20's. Its a very modern art in comparison to most other arts.

Why does everyone thing they're some kind of expert on the history of Budo?

AKI is different from JU. The term(s) imply a philosophy associated with the application of the techniques. Aki came first.

Jutsu is the trickery behind the techniques...

[shadowkiller]

All my info is coming from Invincible warrior, a bio of O'Sensei. Not really sure what you were saying either, how was I wrong?

So aki came before jui? is that what you are saying? Kinda confusing due to the fact that jui justu came before akido and thats what I was saying, wasn't going into the origion of words.

[Tant01]

All my info is coming from Invincible warrior, a bio of O'Sensei. Not really sure what you were saying either, how was I wrong?

So aki came before jui? is that what you are saying? Kinda confusing due to the fact that jui justu came before akido and thats what I was saying, wasn't going into the origion of words.

AKI DO yes AKI No....


I did not say you were wrong. I said a fundamental grasp of the different philosophy is benificial to understand the concepts of AKI and JU. The arts denomination is new but the ideas go back hundreds and hundreds of years. Aki came first... that is all.

[Oraenor]

Despite the samuri being much better trained than the knight, I believe that the knight will beat a samuri because of afew attirbutes;
Knights have much better and heavier armour(platemail plus shield)
knights have much better siege equipment(trebuchet, onaegar,mangonel,arballest etc.)
A knight's lance is much more proficient from a charge than a spear
The longbow or crossbow has much more firepower than the composite bow


A samuri will beat a knight with horse archery or hit in an unarmoured region.

[shadowkiller]

Despite the samuri being much better trained than the knight, I believe that the knight will beat a samuri because of afew attirbutes;
Knights have much better and heavier armour(platemail plus shield)
knights have much better siege equipment(trebuchet, onaegar,mangonel,arballest etc.)
A knight's lance is much more proficient from a charge than a spear
The longbow or crossbow has much more firepower than the composite bow


A samuri will beat a knight with horse archery or hit in an unarmoured region.

If it were just a one on one fight, with no artillery or projectile weapons, no lances or horses, just one on one on the ground with swords. Samurai would win, just for the fact that the armor they wear is much less weighty so they can move faster. Plus the katana would have most likely been able to cleave armour pretty easily I think, if wielded by a skilled samurai.

Just an opinion though.

Plus Samurai are much cooler.

[Oraenor]

If it were just a one on one fight, with no artillery or projectile weapons, no lances or horses, just one on one on the ground with swords. Samurai would win, just for the fact that the armor they wear is much less weighty so they can move faster. Plus the katana would have most likely been able to cleave armour pretty easily I think, if wielded by a skilled samurai.

Just an opinion though.

Plus Samurai are much cooler.

This depended on which era of knights are you refering to. I really dont think the samuri's katana wielded by human strength can cut through chainmail, merely just bruising them. I say this because chainmail is still used as protection when diving with sharks and protection vs the saws and blades in slaughterhouses.If a samuri would beat a knight, it is because of exhaustion from moving in the armour.This is my theory anyway.

[Hardball]

Well, I got what I wanted to see and that was the "Poll of defend.net subcribers" and you folks voted the Samarui better than the Knight 19 to 4. The poll is open indefinetly but I don't think there is no way for the Knight to catch up. The thread presented cooroborated writtings will numerous bibliographies thus the poll was made with facts in mind and not just opinion or for the love of the Samauri.

[cam427]

People assume that a samurai was better trained than a knight but I think that you should check some historical texts before making this assumption.
The fighting arts used by knights were incredibly effective and technical.

They used to have a TV program on in england (I can get english TV here) about middle age weapons and fighting methods and they were pretty impressive.

Most knights also spent alot of time in meditation like the samurai.

I think the biggest problem here is one of perception. The knights on TV and in movies are oten just drunken bullies picking on poor villagers while the Samurai are always pictured as just and honerable warriors. Neither of these is true. As we all know all people are different and there is as much chance of a samurai being a brutal bully as a knight.

Go to www.bbc.co.uk and you may be able to find some information on the show.

Hope this helps
Cam

[Oraenor]

Well, I got what I wanted to see and that was the "Poll of defend.net subcribers" and you folks voted the Samarui better than the Knight 19 to 4. The poll is open indefinetly but I don't think there is no way for the Knight to catch up. The thread presented cooroborated writtings will numerous bibliographies thus the poll was made with facts in mind and not just opinion or for the love of the Samauri.

Your question on the poll is about skill and thus I would have to say the samuri is better skilled. By better, there are alot of different attributes that make one better than the other.

[Hardball]

Your question on the poll is about skill and thus I would have to say the samuri is better skilled. By better, there are alot of different attributes that make one better than the other.

The thread and it's many contributors give you plenty of info to cast an unbiased vote. In fact, I learned a ton about the knight in this thread and also learned a ton about the Monguls.

[Hardball]

The good thing about defend polls is that you can't cheat. It only lets you vote once.

[Hardball]

Glad to see people are still voting on this thread; the Knight doesn't have a chance of catching up!!!!!

[MatthewAlphonso]

I would say the skill between a medieval knight and a feudal samurai is pretty even. Being the the SCA (Society for Creative Anachronism www.sca.org) has given me the unique opportunity to observe combat between people studying Japanese and European arts, though hand and foot techniques are prohibited. and more often than not, in a series of rounds, two people who have studied in their respective arts are evenly matched. If you compare the European fectbooks with the Japanese counterparts you will see that most of the stances are the same, the same goes for the hand techniques, and even unarmed combative techniques are quite similar.

On and unrelated note, in an earlier post someone asked how the "Murder Stroke" would be set up. This is quite simple and in used in a style known as Half-Swording. A half sword is generally betweeh 3.5-4 feet and has several inches of unsharpeded blade near the hilt allowing the user to wield it as either a two handed broad-sword or as a short spear. the Murder Stroke would be done when someone swings with a downward stroke, you would block at the half-sword and step either to the side and either stab with your blade, if an unarmoured spot was available (usually a neck or unarmoured face though the neck would usually have a gorget to protect it), or hook the handguard into a bit of the shoulder or beneath the the helm to bring your adversary to the ground and potentially hold them for ransom(the preferred method) or simply take your dagger and stab your prostrate opponent in the eye slit. .

[Hardball]

I would say the skill between a medieval knight and a feudal samurai is pretty even. Being the the SCA (Society for Creative Anachronism www.sca.org) has given me the unique opportunity to observe combat between people studying Japanese and European arts, though hand and foot techniques are prohibited. and more often than not, in a series of rounds, two people who have studied in their respective arts are evenly matched. If you compare the European fectbooks with the Japanese counterparts you will see that most of the stances are the same, the same goes for the hand techniques, and even unarmed combative techniques are quite similar.

On and unrelated note, in an earlier post someone asked how the "Murder Stroke" would be set up. This is quite simple and in used in a style known as Half-Swording. A half sword is generally betweeh 3.5-4 feet and has several inches of unsharpeded blade near the hilt allowing the user to wield it as either a two handed broad-sword or as a short spear. the Murder Stroke would be done when someone swings with a downward stroke, you would block at the half-sword and step either to the side and either stab with your blade, if an unarmoured spot was available (usually a neck or unarmoured face though the neck would usually have a gorget to protect it), or hook the handguard into a bit of the shoulder or beneath the the helm to bring your adversary to the ground and potentially hold them for ransom(the preferred method) or simply take your dagger and stab your prostrate opponent in the eye slit. .

Did you see the poll results? The people who voted in this poll are experts at martial arts and the history of combat. No disrespect intended but the voting was lop sided. I know, Mike Brewer was a dissenting opinion and probably agrees with you. Since the time that this thread died, I have seen several more knight and samauri movies. I'd have to say that the Samauri were Bad Bad Boys but the Knights were not Wuss's and the Knights were not to be F$#%@& with. Either way, you were in for a battle. I think the Samauri had the advantage with their philosphy on practicing but I'd give the edge to the Knight with their Philosopy of being Defensive.