Wing Chun or Wing Tsun?

[quietobserver]

Wing Chun was originally WC, a meeting of the Yip Man Athletic Association decided that for promotional reasons the initials WC equated with toilets in western writing so looked for an alternative spelling, so WT, VT, or whatever came about. Yip Man did not know English, neither do his sons apart from basic greetings, and the Chinese calligraphy remains constant no matter what.

Leung Ting trade marked 'Wing Tsun' to define his methods. He was never a student of Yip Man, he trained with him yes, had his photo taken with him yes, but in traditional terms he was taught by his uncle, a student of a Leung Sheung, who was the student of Yip Man.

William Cheung's Wing Chun is more the modified one as he left Hong Kong for Australia when 18 years old, hence the general lack of recognised chi sau and concentration on sparring as he was more of a fighter.

Unless of course you believe that Yip Man would decide that a 12 year old boy was going to be the one and only possessor of the true 'traditional' Wing Chun and all his friends who had helped him through hard times and both of his sons were going to be taught watered down lies or 'modified' Wing Chun. William Cheung's version not mine, its the beauty of print, unlike the fact that a dead man cannot come back to deny you, the words you publish in magazines can do years after?

It's true that most of the Wing Chun concepts Leung Ting learned were from his uncle. His uncle taught him the basic forms and he taught him the long pole form. Yip Man taught Leung Ting the butterfly swords and the Wooden Dummy. Leung Ting came from a rich family and he paid a considerable amount of money to Yip Man to teach him the more advanced techniques of Wing Chun. The benefit that Leung Ting had over the other WC instructors was he was able to find an extremely wealthy man to spread his version of Wing Chun throughout Europe. This man was Keith Kernspecht, who at the time of meeting Leung Ting was already a multi millionaire. Kernspecht is the true genius behind the WT system and Leung Ting is more of a figurehead. Kernspecht is the one who created the curriculum and having a background in wrestling, boxing, weight lifting, he was the first in the Wing Chun world to really incorporate cross training and apply it to his Wing Chun. Also the benefit of having thousands of students to test your theories did not hurt as well when a typical Yip Man class only consisted of maybe 10 or 25 students. Leung Ting is not a very good businessman, and he's gone bankrupt several times and Kernspecht had to bail him out. That's why Kernspecht's title is the same as Leung Ting. They both are ranked at 10th level Grandmaster. As for WT, it's a different way of Wing Chun. I can't say if it's good or bad but there are definitely some pretty good martial artists in WT and there are some pretty good ones in other branches. It really depends on the person. For some WT is a better fit and for others it's not as good of a fit.

[tjwingchun]

Wing Chun was originally WC, a meeting of the Yip Man Athletic Association decided that for promotional reasons the initials WC equated with toilets in western writing so looked for an alternative spelling, so WT, VT, or whatever came about. Yip Man did not know English, neither do his sons apart from basic greetings, and the Chinese calligraphy remains constant no matter what.

Leung Ting trade marked 'Wing Tsun' to define his methods. He was never a student of Yip Man, he trained with him yes, had his photo taken with him yes, but in traditional terms he was taught by his uncle, a student of a Leung Sheung, who was the student of Yip Man.

William Cheung's Wing Chun is more the modified one as he left Hong Kong for Australia when 18 years old, hence the general lack of recognised chi sau and concentration on sparring as he was more of a fighter.

Unless of course you believe that Yip Man would decide that a 12 year old boy was going to be the one and only possessor of the true 'traditional' Wing Chun and all his friends who had helped him through hard times and both of his sons were going to be taught watered down lies or 'modified' Wing Chun. William Cheung's version not mine, its the beauty of print, unlike the fact that a dead man cannot come back to deny you, the words you publish in magazines can do years after?

[MHack]

I heard that Wing Chun and Wing Tsun is almost the same thing but there are a few differences. Can someone tell me which i should take and what the differences are?

Ving Tsun is the Modified form of Wing Chun. Some schools with having you 'roll' hands forever before getting to the serious stuff or even using the wooden dummy (jong). If you want the traditional style, you've got to go to GrandMaster William Cheung Schools. Modified often falls into the rut boxing, karate, etc.. does by fighting in the center leaving oneself open in an almost game of tag like scenario. Somebody on this system misinterpreted Traditional and was actually describing Modified.

[phenom]

that story has no credible evidence to get close to the real story check out benny ming museum of wing chun china

[47MartialMan]

Yeah, go here http://www.moyyat.com/origins.html they have good links to other schools

Thanks....any more?

[TheJong]

You cannot move period
walking is cont. shiftinng your weight
Even if your weight isn't distributed balanced, you still have to shift it to move
Only way to move without shifting it fom left to right is jumping

That did make me sound kinda dumb. What I mean is if I had all my weight equally balanced my foot work would be slow in a fight. We don't just stand there in the "wing chun stance" and hope to hit something.

[Hardball]

ya want change?...jj

agreed. any style isn't bad to experiment with, take what you can actually use and go with it.

What about the butterfly swords and the dragon pole? Both wing chun staples.

[Tom Yum]

I think it's a great system for CROSS TRAINING. My .02 worth!!

ya want change?...jj

agreed. any style isn't bad to experiment with, take what you can actually use and go with it.

[Toudiyama[NL]]

The Ving Tsun I study teaches you to shift your weight between legs. You can not move fast if the weight is equal.

You cannot move period
walking is cont. shiftinng your weight
Even if your weight isn't distributed balanced, you still have to shift it to move
Only way to move without shifting it fom left to right is jumping

[Hardball]

Wing Chun= Sil lim tao, chum kil, bil jee, chi sao, wooden dummy. I think it's a great system for CROSS TRAINING. My .02 worth!!

[TheJong]

Yeah, go here http://www.moyyat.com/origins.html they have good links to other schools

[47MartialMan]

Mine? Moy Yat.

Any links?

[TheJong]

Mine? Moy Yat.

[47MartialMan]

Yeah, bit it has a closely knitted lineage-what is yours?

[TheJong]

The Ving Tsun I study teaches you to shift your weight between legs. You can not move fast if the weight is equal.